Extending unemployment

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Magician's picture
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Joined: 2008-05-19

Back to unemployment.  Read the Trust Company RIA thread for the obviousness of people who are lazy and won't either pay for what they need or do it themselves.We've bred this into our society.Get to work, people!

navet's picture
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Joined: 2010-02-25

Like most neocons you guys insist on beating a dead horse. As for unemployment? Lots of luck with that position. Calling unemployed people "lazy F-ckers", will go far in the next election. And the "let the one's who can't pay die" attitude on national healthcare will go just as far. It's like you guys like to hear yourselves talk, even long after you lost on the issue. Remember when Taft was still pissing and moaning about FDR 20 years after the New Deal passed? And I'd love to hear your thoughts on civil rights, another issue you lost. You all do know you lost? And even after a slight dead cat bounce in the mid-terms(if you're lucky), your party and movement are dead in the water.

Magician's picture
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Joined: 2008-05-19

Navet - There's a difference between doing what is politically expedient and doing what is right.Interesting thought on civil rights, considering some of the most racist anti-integration politicians were liberal Democrats.  Just like most of the big spenders were conservative Republicans.  How's that for irony?Navet, how is it possible to get so old and still be so stupid?

navet's picture
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Joined: 2010-02-25

Right?

BondGuy's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-21

RealWorld wrote:I don't think bonds are very intellectual. I agree!!!!!! I don't find bonds to be very intellectual either. Being that the word intellectual can be used as a noun or an adjective, you used it as a noun. As a noun it can only be used to describe a person, not an inanimate object or intangible investment. So bonds can't be intellectual. I was hoping you'd pick up on the three word thing, we could go back and forth a few times, three words at a time, and we could stick a fork in this thread, because it's done. Ok, let's move on. I'm sure we can find common ground on other subjects.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

BG - sure we can find common ground, but how much fun is that if we agree all the time?  I come on here everyday now not to find great ideas about how to be a better FA, but to find out what stupid things navet has posted.    navet - how did "we" lose on civil rights?  Magician is correct that some of the heroes of the Progressive movement like Wilson, FDR, Teddy Roosevelt, and Margaret Sanger were incredibly racist and supporters of the eugenics ideas of the turn of the last century.  They were all trying to figure out how to quietly get rid of people of color.  But yet you have the gall to call us racists, and tell us we lost the battle on civil rights?  If that's not the pot calling the kettle black, I don't know what is.You've told us a few times that we should turn off Glenn Beck and actually go read some history.  I'm going to suggest you do the same.  Go back and actually figure out what caused the roaring 20's and then what caused the Great Depression.   What you'll find is there is a direct correlation between the size of the government and the prosperity of the country.  And that correlation isn't bigger is better.  Once you figure that out, perhaps you'll change your tune on all of the government programs the progressive renaissance would like to put in place.  Unless you really want to revisit the 1930 economically, that is.       

RealWorld's picture
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Joined: 2009-07-13

I had an appointment just leave who was one of my glorious goodknight accounts.Not a large account by any means. I asked her what has been new."Well my unemployment runs out at the end of august; looks like I will have to get one of those jobs at (names two 12-14 pr hour places that are hiring)...I thought that was really timely and hilarious given the context of our conversation.I also heard today that if we do not extend unemployment then at that same time 2 million people or 25% of the current unemployed are going to lose benefits. I see this being a problem with such a large number coming off at the same time.Really would be good to discuss a solution or I guess I at least wish that Washington had a few ideas.

BondGuy's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-21

RealWorld wrote: "Well my unemployment runs out at the end of august; looks like I will have to get one of those jobs at (names two 12-14 pr hour places that are hiring)... Dude, that's cold!!! You know damn well there are no jobs paying $12 to $14  an hour just for the taking. There aren't jobs paying $10 an hour just for the taking. The probelm is too many unemployed chasing too few jobs. You should stop with the right wing hate machine spin of devaluing the unemployed as lazy. The chronically unemployed have to chose between paying ON the electric bill or buying food. Why aren't they going after those $14 an hour jobs? Gee, the must like having the kids go hungry! In fact, not only are there no jobs for these people, the employers in the jobs easy to get catagory are taking advantage of the buyers market for out of work employees. They are lowering their pay scales. New employees starting in jobs that use to pay $9 an hour now get minimum wage. Current employees are seeing their hourly wages rolled back. Don't like it, get out!!!!! There is line a mile long waiting to get in the door. Which neatly explains why your claim of $12 to $14 a hour jobs is bullshit.And then there is this: The republicans in the Senate blocked the Bill extending benefits stating there weren't offsetting spending cuts to balance the Bill. True enough, there aren't offsets. Yet, when the republican controlled Senate and Congress passed Bush's tax cuts into law there weren't offsetting spending cuts in that Bill to balance the lost revenue. That Bill sailed through both houses. Realize, this week, as the republicans get up to preach fiscal responsibility that they are talking out of both sides of their well fed mouths. And they are doing so on the backs of the unemployed poor.Lastly,  find an unemployed family, and buy them their groceries! Get their electric turned back on. Pay for them to take their kids to the dentist. Stop making excuses and do something! You want realworld? It doesn't get anymore real than that! If  you don't have money in the budget for that, try this, stop giving money to your church. Use that money to do God's work close up and personal. Your church will stop loving you but God won't. And 100% of your money and effort will go to helping a family in need.

N.D.'s picture
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Joined: 2009-07-14

BondGuy wrote:Lastly,  find an unemployed family, and buy them their groceries! Get their electric turned back on. Pay for them to take their kids to the dentist. Stop making excuses and do something! You want realworld? It doesn't get anymore real than that! If  you don't have money in the budget for that, try this, stop giving money to your church. Use that money to do God's work close up and personal. Your church will stop loving you but God won't. And 100% of your money and effort will go to helping a family in need.These are great words of wisdom BG! I am sorry the churches you are familiar with do not do as you have just described someone to do with their money. I can say the church I attend does just that and more. We offer daycare services three days a week for anyone to job seek and we also do a rotating daycare for single parents to work and spend a little time to themselves when needed. I do not agree with enabling unproductive activities but hey it's just like raising kids, sooner or later you gotta let them risk falling in order to ever fly. If the net stays close underneath they will not jump very far.

Magician's picture
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Joined: 2008-05-19

I have two job openings.  One paying $15/hr, and another paying $12/hr.  The people that I've gotten - sloppy, whorish have not done anything in twelve months.All of the really good people have jobs.BG - I'm seriously just telling you from experience, and recent experience at that.  I lost one of my best people to a job four weeks ago.  I like to think the experience at my shop helped her get the job.  At 24, this girls is now managing twelve people, getting full benes, and making $40k a year. 

BondGuy's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-21

N.D. wrote:BondGuy wrote:Lastly,  find an unemployed family, and buy them their groceries! Get their electric turned back on. Pay for them to take their kids to the dentist. Stop making excuses and do something! You want realworld? It doesn't get anymore real than that! If  you don't have money in the budget for that, try this, stop giving money to your church. Use that money to do God's work close up and personal. Your church will stop loving you but God won't. And 100% of your money and effort will go to helping a family in need. These are great words of wisdom BG! I am sorry the churches you are familiar with do not do as you have just described someone to do with their money. I can say the church I attend does just that and more. We offer daycare services three days a week for anyone to job seek and we also do a rotating daycare for single parents to work and spend a little time to themselves when needed. I do not agree with enabling unproductive activities but hey it's just like raising kids, sooner or later you gotta let them risk falling in order to ever fly. If the net stays close underneath they will not jump very far.Our churches are no different. What i'm saying is it's not good enough. get out there and help someone yourself. You decide who to help and how to help them instead of leaving it up to someone else to get their hands dirty. Two things will happen: First someone's family will get a much needed no strings attached helping hand from someone who can do with a little less fat. Second, you'll understand the problem and stop insisting these people have employment options they are too lazy, proud, or stubborn to take advantage of. You(figurative you) will finally grasp the desperate complexity of the situation.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

Actually, you shouldn't stop giving to your church.  You should add helping family member, friend, or neighbor in need to what you are already doing. The primary mission of the church is not benevolence.  It's salvation.  If you stop giving your money to the church and just give it to the needy, you lose focus of the purpose we have a church at all. 

cemxye's picture
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Joined: 2010-09-30

RealWorld wrote:I was telling my wife how I thought it was amazing that so many Americans work in finance yet we are a country that is destructing from within due to poor budget control. Literally I spend 70% of my life going over finance with my clients while watching my country spiral into a nosedive based upon not being able to manage their own wallet.I wondered what some intelligent thoughts would be on unemployment benefits in this country. We must realize that with the non passage of the extension that we are going to have millions of people with no work, no benefits coming down the pike.What is the best (INTELLIGENT) way to deal with this situation and even the more broad issue of national debt? All I can say is cut the expenditures then concentrate on incoming investors to invest to boosts economic and employment in a country. 

newregrep's picture
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Joined: 2010-03-22

I think welfare, unemployment and food stamps should all stop at some point.  I agree with many others on this board that human beings are lazy in nature...hell we work HARD so we can be LAZIER..oh the irony.My heart goes out to those real hard working citizens who have lost their jobs due to America failing to keep jobs in the U.S. aka unregulated captialism.  But there are also many lazy ones who take things for granted.I'll give you an example I see all the time when I goto the supermarket.  I see someone using a EBT card buying steaks, lavish cakes, and other treats at the supermarket.  They have Northface jackets, with $200 dollar cellphones, designer boots and hop into their Mercedes Bens and drive home. WHAT?While I'm standing in line, buying raw goods so I can cook in batches for the week!  What is wrong with this picture?I even remember speaking to someone years back, this man said, "Why would I find work? I make about the same when I DON'T WORK, live in project housing for free, and government gives me money for food.  This country is the BEST"It's disgusting to see this happen.  I agree with unemployment and food stamps as long as it's REGULATED.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

It's a mentality that has unfortunately become more prevalent as the government pushes harder and harder in their attempts to redistribute our wealth.  My church is doing a coat drive this year.  A guy I know recently delivered some coats to a "needy" family in our area.  He said he walked in the front door and the kids were playing on their Wii in front of their big screen TV, but yet he was delivering coats to them because they said they needed them.  He said while he was there a 12 year old neighbor came over to ask for some help with changing a tire.  The mom said he could borrow hers and so my buddy went out to help.  She opened the garage and there was a Nissan Armada sitting there.  She probably gets food stamps from the government, lives in HUD housing, gets her kids meals paid for at school, visits medical clinics for free, but has a $50,000 SUV, $1000 TV, $200 game system, and probably cell phones with text packages and data plans.  The sad thing is that way too many people in this country expect to live that kind of lifestyle.  And when they can't afford it, they expect the government to pay for it for them.  Personal responsibility is making a slow exit. 

Kaner's picture
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Joined: 2010-06-17

Spiff.....Nail, meet hammer.   Nice job!

newregrep's picture
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Joined: 2010-03-22

It's really sad to see this happenin because there are real people struggling out there as well as these lazy folks who are leeching off the tax-payers.I came to this country when I was 10 years old with my family.  None of us knew a zip of english, and my father worked 2 jobs (7-11 cashier, and door to door chimney cleaning sale in a Korean neighborhood), mother worked 2 jobs (nail salon 10 hours a day 7 days a week and being a mother), as soon as I hit 16 I worked 2 jobs and so did my brother.  We all paid rent and saved $$ together until my parents saved enough money to buy a business and now they are living comfortably.I paid for my entire college education on my own, by working full time and going to school full time.  Not even an hourly pay, it was a chop shop mortgage firm and I cold called and got paid 15 dollars per lead, and a tiny percentage when it closed LOL.  I'm not the brightest bulb either and if I can do it why can't they?? I lived on peanut butter and jelly the entire way pretty much with cans of tuna for protein.This is why I do less and less charity in America and rather donate money elsewhere, where people actually need help.  If my parents can come here without having American education, the language proficiency, no friends, family, and STILL survive and thrive through hard work and dedication, I can't see why people who are born here have any excuse not to.   

Kaner's picture
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Joined: 2010-06-17

New - your story is a great example of where the truely wealthy in America come from.  These are the folks Stanley and Danko were speaking of in The Millionaire Next Door.  The problem is 3rd and 4th generations born into the American lifestyle.  They learn to spend, don't save, and feel entitled.

BondGuy's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-21

newregrep wrote:I think welfare, unemployment and food stamps should all stop at some point.  I agree with many others on this board that human beings are lazy in nature...hell we work HARD so we can be LAZIER..oh the irony.My heart goes out to those real hard working citizens who have lost their jobs due to America failing to keep jobs in the U.S. aka unregulated captialism.  But there are also many lazy ones who take things for granted.I'll give you an example I see all the time when I goto the supermarket.  I see someone using a EBT card buying steaks, lavish cakes, and other treats at the supermarket.  They have Northface jackets, with $200 dollar cellphones, designer boots and hop into their Mercedes Bens and drive home. WHAT?While I'm standing in line, buying raw goods so I can cook in batches for the week!  What is wrong with this picture?I even remember speaking to someone years back, this man said, "Why would I find work? I make about the same when I DON'T WORK, live in project housing for free, and government gives me money for food.  This country is the BEST"It's disgusting to see this happen.  I agree with unemployment and food stamps as long as it's REGULATED. You picked this person out of a crowded supermarket full of people and watched them? Somehow, you knew they were unemployed? Just from what, the way they looked, the way they walked, something, something told you these people were unemployed goldbrickin welfare cheaten scum? Then you noted everything they were buying. You took inventory. And, sure enough you were right when they pulled out that card! Then you continued the stake out, following them out to the parking lot where you watched them load up the new Mercedes. And, somewhere in there you also put your cell phone expertise to good use noting the expensive cell phone they, apparently pulled out and used while they were loading up all the free groceries.  Yeah, that's totally believable.

newregrep's picture
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Joined: 2010-03-22

BG, come on, you've NEVER seen this happen?Maybe you're from a real affluent neighborhood but I'm from Queens NY, a good blend of wealth, middle, and the poor.  I happen to be behind this person, and I saw the entire transaction.  Excessive texting on the brand new iphone (easily $200..doesn't take a phone expert to notice an iphone), a northface jacket, and a few designer items.  Maybe I should mind my own business...but I always watch the transaction in front of me at the supermarket.  Our supermarket has a pull up station like IKEA where you can pull up your car and load the groceries and it's really hard NOT to look out the gigantic row of windows in front of me.The point I'm making is, why does anyone who can afford all these other expensive items need government help?? 

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

You'll have to excuse BG.  His politics lean just ever so slightly to the left.  He's naturally forgiving of those folks who might be cheating the system.  To be fair to the guy in front of you in the checkout line - he probably bought the Northface jacket at Goodwill, he got the iPhone from a wealthy neighbor who upgraded and felt generous enough to just give his old phone away rather than sell it on Ebay, the car belonged to his recently deceased father, and the rest of the clothes were knock offs purchased in Chinatown.  I got a very nice Guccci purse for my wife there one time. BG - I think I've made that same type of observation dozens of times checking out at our local supermarket or Wal-Mart.  I'm always amazed that the retailers have to put up signs that say they won't accept EBT cards for things like cigs or beer.  You can't scrape enough money together to buy bread and milk for your 5 kids (who all get welfare checks, free lunches at school, free after school care, free school supplies (purchased by other parents), etc), but you sure as heck can scrape enough money together to buy a carton of cigarettes and a case of beer every week, a cell phone package with the works, and cable package with all the HD channels so  you can fully utilize your 52 inch flat screen.   His point is absolutely spot on that there are way too many people using EBT cards, otherwise known as my money, to buy crap at the grocery store they don't really need, thinking that they are entitled to that money for some reason or another.  All the while spending their money on stuff that used to be considered luxuries.  Now, before you get your panties in a wad, I know there are a lot of folks who use those services the right way, more than likely the majority of them.  It's those folks that don't that seem to always be in front of us in the checkout lanes.   

BondGuy's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-21

Ah,  you guys are jealous because the unemployed person was dressed better than you and drives a better car? So, of course they must be cheating the system?The average unemployment chk in this country is $293 a week. if you can buy a new Mercedes, designer clothes, and the highest end consumer electronics on that, more power to you!!!! I'm a little hinked out that there are guys in supermarkets paying so much attention to female shoppers. Around here that earns you a chat with the local PD.!!!   

lovindaindy's picture
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Joined: 2009-05-07

BG - I have to tell you.  There are some people who are hypervigilant.  Either they served in the military, or are former police or current police officers.  And they notice things.  I can't believe you never noticed something like that.Here is something funny.  I was at this place called Bahama Breeze a few years back (Not in the Bahamas).  This guy was outside wearing some old rags and had a sign that read, "Homeless, Hungry and Humble".  After about two hours of panhandling, he pulls out his cell phone (this was before iPhones), checks the time and then begins to walk to the far parking lot.  I watched him go.  I almost yelled when I saw him approach a Mercedes SUV (Don't know the name off of the top of my head).  But then I saw him get out his keys.  He through his sign in the back.  Took off his ragged coat, revealing a nice shirt underneath, and got in his car. 

althearobyns's picture
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Joined: 2012-10-30

Unemployment benefits are not a net stimulative factor, since they are not new money: they are funded by employment payroll taxes. As costs of benefits rise, employed worker cash compensation shrinks. With rates higher, costs rise to employers without any increase in worker's paychecks. We need a safety net, but we need jobs even more urgently. Private sector jobs increase wealth and fund government, government sector jobs simply move existing wealth around.

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