What happened to voltmoie?
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[quote=anonymous]“4 - In my opinion, it is absolutely different. Being gay is a choice. Getting cancer isn’t. Equating a lifestyle choice to a disease isn’t even a fair comparison.”
Spaceman, I am really looking for some sort of explanation for this. I do understand that the act of having sex with one's own sex is a choice. If I'm not mistaken, "being gay" means that one is attracted to someone of their own sex. How is this a choice? I couldn't choose to attracted to someone of my sex even if I wanted to do so. I also couldn't choose to be attracted to the 500 pound smelly mean girl with acne and going bald. Are you saying that one has the choice as to whom they will find attractive?[/quote] Depends on the number of beers.[quote=Mr.Blonde][quote=anonymous]“4 - In my opinion, it is absolutely different. Being gay is a choice. Getting cancer isn’t. Equating a lifestyle choice to a disease isn’t even a fair comparison.”
Spaceman, I am really looking for some sort of explanation for this. I do understand that the act of having sex with one's own sex is a choice. If I'm not mistaken, "being gay" means that one is attracted to someone of their own sex. How is this a choice? I couldn't choose to attracted to someone of my sex even if I wanted to do so. I also couldn't choose to be attracted to the 500 pound smelly mean girl with acne and going bald. Are you saying that one has the choice as to whom they will find attractive?[/quote] Depends on the number of beers.[/quote] P.S. Volt was a loser anywaysYou're right, you have. My point was that not one of the people who called me a bigot are about to call anyone who disagrees with my point of view a bigot.
Hey now, I’ve been bashing 52 all over the place. I’m not a religious man, but I do follow some tenets.
You're right, you have. My point was that not one of the people who called me a bigot are about to call anyone who disagrees with my point of view a bigot. [/quote] That's because tolerence does not make you a bigot douche bag.[quote=Moraen]
Hey now, I’ve been bashing 52 all over the place. I’m not a religious man, but I do follow some tenets.
You're right, you have. My point was that not one of the people who called me a bigot are about to call anyone who disagrees with my point of view a bigot. [/quote] That's because tolerence does not make you a bigot douche bag.[/quote][quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=Moraen]
Hey now, I’ve been bashing 52 all over the place. I’m not a religious man, but I do follow some tenets.
I believe calling people who are religious "nutjobs" and other names is bigotry. That is being intolerant of peoples beliefs, correct? Who decides who is on the right side?
Once again, I go to yoga and that's my religion if you can call it that. But I'm not going to say someone is a bigot because he believes in the Bible. Or the Koran.
I think you guys are giving Spiff waaaaay to hard of a time for his beliefs. I'm glad to see that at least he stands up for them.
mlgone - “I don’t take the book as if it is gospel”
Do you take the gospel as if it is gospel ? What the hell are you talking about ? You "go to church" and send your kids to Christian school, but you don't believe the gospel is in fact the teachings of Jesus, even though that is the actual definition. And you call Spiff scary ?I could careless about Spiffs interpertation of the bible. He is hiding behind his religion as a way to express his bigot like behavior. He is a suicide bomber of words with a suit on.
I'm not a fan of homosexuality. I do not agree with their lifestyle. I tell my gay "male" friends as much. However, it is not my place to judge. God or the ground will sort it all out.Who really cares if gays are born that way or not? Everyone can choose to be around the people they want to be around. You guys don’t like strict christian believers, fine don’t hang out with them. Spiff doesn’t want to hang out at gay bars, fine he wont.
Well there is a huge difference between the gospel and the Catholic Church. Thanks for the clarification.
Great, I call anyone who wants to doctor the Christian faith to conform with today's society scary. My opinion, I dont care what you think.[quote=hotair1]
I could careless about Spiffs interpertation of the bible. He is hiding behind his religion as a way to express his bigot like behavior. He is a suicide bomber of words with a suit on.
I'm not a fan of homosexuality. I do not agree with their lifestyle. I tell my gay "male" friends as much. However, it is not my place to judge. God or the ground will sort it all out.[/quote]Yet you are judging Spiff. Some times things don't come through in posts. I am just trying to figure out what you are trying to say.
I believe Spiff is justified in taking some of the bashers to task. Here is a quote from 52new in relation to christian conservative groups:
"The idiotic reaction to national healthcare reform is further proof of the foolishness and evil of that group."
The words "foolishness" and "evil" are a little stronger than "uncomfortable" and "creepy".
[quote=Moraen] [quote=hotair1]
I could careless about Spiffs interpertation of the bible. He is hiding behind his religion as a way to express his bigot like behavior. He is a suicide bomber of words with a suit on.
I'm not a fan of homosexuality. I do not agree with their lifestyle. I tell my gay "male" friends as much. However, it is not my place to judge. God or the ground will sort it all out.[/quote]Yet you are judging Spiff. Some times things don't come through in posts. I am just trying to figure out what you are trying to say.
I believe Spiff is justified in taking some of the bashers to task. Here is a quote from 52new in relation to christian conservative groups:
"The idiotic reaction to national healthcare reform is further proof of the foolishness and evil of that group."
The words "foolishness" and "evil" are a little stronger than "uncomfortable" and "creepy".
[/quote] This is the entire point !!!!! If you say you are uncomfortable around gays, on this forum or anywhere else, you get absolutely roasted, you are a bigot. If you are uncomfortable around christians or church goers you aren't even questioned.
They are bigots as well, Ron.
Although I will confess some Christians will judge you outloud more often than any group I've come across. That does make me uncomfotable. Just like when you and Volt made out on the steets of Chicago.I know they are bigots. My point is there is a double standard when it comes to the criticism each side gets.
This is a news flash, THERE ARE GAYS WHO ARE UNCOMFORTABLE AROUND HETEROSEXUALS.Ok. So Spiff says he is uncomfortable around gays and he stands by his Christian faith and you guys destroy him. You guys make gay jokes, but that is ok ? What gives ? I am uncomfortable around gays and I rip them, at least I admit it!
[quote=Ron 14]
Ok. So Spiff says he is uncomfortable around gays and he stands by his Christian faith and you guys destroy him. You guys make gay jokes, but that is ok ? What gives ? I am uncomfortable around gays and I rip them, at least I admit it!
[/quote] Come out of the closet ad I'll tell you.[quote=Ron 14]
Ok. So Spiff says he is uncomfortable around gays and he stands by his Christian faith and you guys destroy him. You guys make gay jokes, but that is ok ? What gives ? I am uncomfortable around gays and I rip them, at least I admit it!
[/quote]It’s called the I’m right/You’re wrong six year old mentality.
[quote=LockEDJ] [quote=Spaceman Spiff] …
I just looked at this passage. Funny thing, no reference to homosexuality there.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]
Social justice isn't the same as God's judgement. [/quote]
And of course, this is precisely my point, made earlier ... that most of the tenets used to harass gays are as culturally based as demeaning females or approving of slavery. And it's worthwhile saying again - there are no passages in the Bible where homosexuality isn't decried as a part of some sort of other deviancy like rape or promiscuity. As I perceive my homosexual friends, I see neither rape or promiscuity.
Painting them as such is the domain of the religious few that would prefer to simply demean them than understand them. It's easy to think they want to get abuse little boys (when, in fact, heterosexual child abuse is far more prevalent) or to think they can't stay faithful (when divorce rates sail above 50%), and so deserving of God's wrath - and by extension, ours. It is a short path from demeaning a group of society, and it nearly always starts with some sort of religious justification.
As regards 52 ... a butthead. As regards my comments towards yourself ... I don't think I called you a bigot and my apologies if that seems the case. I probably jumped to the conclusion that you believe that Aids was sent by our Lord to kill gays. But that's a natural extension of what you've written here.[/quote] You're correct that there is isn't a singular verse that randomly says don't be gay. There are always other specific people you shouldn't have sex with or, like in the NT, they just use the phrase sexual immorality. The assumption being there that they knew the rules God gave us back in the OT. As to the ten commandments, you're also correct that He didn't specifically reference homosexuality. He did however put in v.14 which says not to commit adultery. Which covers pretty much anything other than having sex with your husband or wife. As to it being decried as a part of another deviancy - so are you saying that as long as I'm having a homosexual relationship with just one person and not cheating on my "spouse" that it's OK? The vast majority of Christians aren't out there harrassing gay people. There are some who will, but they are the minority. The majority of us don't spend any time at all thinking about who to harrass next. We have enough trouble trying to keep ourselves in line without adding other people's issues into the mix.
Well the only thing I have learned from this debate is that nobody ever has any reason to feel uncomfortable around someone else.
If your neighbor is making out with his boyfriend on the couch and their child and your child are playing legos that is no reason to feel uncomfortable. If your friend is actively cheating on his wife that is no reason to feel uncomfortable. If a neighbor is a registered sex offender that is no reason to feel uncomfortable. If your babysitter has dudes over when she is babysitting that is no reason to feel uncomfortable. If your lawn care guy is an ex-con and your wife is home alone that is no reason to feel uncomfortable. Its all good. Its all acceptable. Lets give everyone a big hug !!!! Bigot - any person who is utterly intolerant of any differing creed, belief, or opinion. I guess I am a bigot because I am utterly intolerant of all of these beliefs.[quote=mlgone]a six year old mentality is when someone feels “creepy” about gay people[/quote]
is the same true when a homosexual feels “creepy” about heterosexual relationships as happens often? or is there a double standard?
[quote=Spaceman Spiff] …so are you saying that as long as I’m having a homosexual relationship with just one person and not cheating on my “spouse” that it’s OK?
Yes. In fact, I’ve been saying just that for some time.
[/quote]
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]
The vast majority of Christians aren’t out there harrassing gay people.[/quote]
The vast majority of any people out there aren’t doing anything. The vast majority watch Jerry Springer, eat too much, don’t save enough and think Barack Obama and Obama Bin Laden are related.
At issue is that the vast majority of those that do harass gay people are, in fact, Christians.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]… We have enough trouble trying to keep ourselves in line without adding other people’s issues into the mix[/quote]
Here we agree … I wish that people would, in fact, worry more about the themselves than the lifestyles of others. Wishing you and yours a faithful, prosperous New Year, Space.