Wanna-be Regional Smack Talk

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WORLD PEACE's picture
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Nothing has changed:
 
Regionals=Triple A.
 
would you bad-ass $300k rainmakers please chill.

Moraen's picture
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This ought to be fun.
 
 

nestegg's picture
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Someone is suffering from little man syndrome...what happened did another client ACAT to a regional?

Moraen's picture
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nestegg wrote:Someone is suffering from little man syndrome...what happened did another client ACAT to a regional?
 
seems to be a theme lately.

Sportsfreakbob's picture
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WORLD PEACE wrote:
 
Nothing has changed:
 
Regionals=Triple A.
 
would you bad-ass $300k rainmakers please chill.
Another big swingin d*** hits the forum! Welcome, BSD!

Moraen's picture
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Nothing has changed
WORLD PEACE = Delusion
 
would you idiots quit thinking that you have the lock on large production?

Gordon Gekko's picture
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Let World Peace with his 6 total posts have fun.  Although when I saw triple A I thought he meant credit rating.

2wheeledbeemer's picture
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Based on his avatar, I'd surmize he's ticked that the rate on his $4,713 balance hanging out there on his Countrywide HELOC got jacked up to Prime plus 1/3 of his T12.

WORLD PEACE's picture
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Gordon Gekko wrote:Let World Peace with his 6 total posts have fun.  Although when I saw triple A I thought he meant credit rating.
 
 
You know, triple A ball is a bad example.   Those guys cant really make much of a living.
 
Regionals are more like hoops in Europe.  Thats it. 
You can make it in the real NBA show (wirehouse) so you go to Greece (Steifel) or Ubekastand (Jones)and play.   Perfect
 

Moraen's picture
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WORLD PEACE wrote:Gordon Gekko wrote:Let World Peace with his 6 total posts have fun.  Although when I saw triple A I thought he meant credit rating.
 
 
You know, triple A ball is a bad example.   Those guys cant really make much of a living.
 
Regionals are more like hoops in Europe.  Thats it. 
You can make it in the real NBA show (wirehouse) so you go to Greece (Steifel) or Ubekastand (Jones)and play.   Perfect
 
 
Did you mean "can't" instead of "can"?  And you can't spell Uzbekistan?  Are the wirehouse standards so low?

anonymous's picture
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World Peace, do you care more about your firm or supporting your family? 
 
I'm asking because I think that based upon your analogy, I must be playing double A ball or playing hoops in the now defunct 6 foot 4 inch and shorter basketball league.
 
However, my "team" pays me 80%+ on GDC, over 100% on insurance sales (no grid + overrides), 401(k), pension, free rent, health insurance, etc, and 4 free trips a year.
 
I could go to the NBA show anytime that I wanted.  Please explain why I would want to have my pay cut in third to do so.

chief123's picture
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I think the analogy he makes was true back in the 90s... However with RIAs, larger independents, Wirehouse selling locations to regionals, Stock options being worthless... there is a change..

Like high school kids skipping college to go to get paid in europe instead of not getting paid to play in college.

A better example would be Josh Childress, who played in the NBA(so had the talent to do so) but was offered 3yrs $20million net income(not taxes, and doesn't have to pay for where he lives or what he eats) as opposed to the 5yr $33million gross deal(taxes alone would kill him). Not saying he won't come back, but for now the pay is worth it.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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WORLD PEACE wrote:Gordon Gekko wrote:Let World Peace with his 6 total posts have fun.  Although when I saw triple A I thought he meant credit rating.
 
 
You know, triple A ball is a bad example.   Those guys cant really make much of a living.
 
Regionals are more like hoops in Europe.  Thats it. 
You can make it in the real NBA show (wirehouse) so you go to Greece (Steifel) or Ubekastand (Jones)and play.   Perfect
 
 
You mean the "real show" like Merrill or Smith Barney?  Where are they now?  Right, they were soooo successful at playing in the "show" that they had to have some other minor league team pick up all those contracts.  Yeah, that sounds like success to me.  Funny thing about the "show" is the fans.  Seems the fans don't like to watch the show much anymore.  Makes their stomachs hurt to think about paying those high ticket prices to get in, see their wonderful team losing the game, all the while raking in the big bucks for doing it.  Seems they'd rather see what watching AAA or even A ball is like.  Certainly those guys can't perform any worse than the big dogs.  Especially when some of the stars from the big leagues decided to voluntarily move down to AAA ball.  So record numbers of fans are now going to AAA games than the pros.   
 
You guys in pros looked more like the Harlem Globetrotters recently than a really competitive team.  Actually, I gave you too much credit.  The Washington Generals are more appropriate.   

nestegg's picture
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Gordon Gekko wrote:Let World Peace with his 6 total posts have fun.  Although when I saw triple A I thought he meant credit rating.
 
LMAO good one Gordo!

Gordon Gekko's picture
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I chuckle when I see the CitiMorg commercial that says the two firms came together to solve tough problems or some BS like that. Nothing about Citibank almost going out of business. My regional doesn't have tv commercials but apparently I am not missing out on much.
 
Does anyone else feel dumber every time they visit this chat board?

WORLD PEACE's picture
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[quote=
 
 
You mean the "real show" like Merrill or Smith Barney?  Where are they now?  Right, they were soooo successful at playing in the "show" that they had to have some other minor league team pick up all those contracts.  Yeah, that sounds like success to me.  Funny thing about the "show" is the fans.  Seems the fans don't like to watch the show much anymore.  Makes their stomachs hurt to think about paying those high ticket prices to get in, see their wonderful team losing the game, all the while raking in the big bucks for doing it.  Seems they'd rather see what watching AAA or even A ball is like.  Certainly those guys can't perform any worse than the big dogs.  Especially when some of the stars from the big leagues decided to voluntarily move down to AAA ball.  So record numbers of fans are now going to AAA games than the pros.   
 
You guys in pros looked more like the Harlem Globetrotters recently than a really competitive team.  Actually, I gave you too much credit.  The Washington Generals are more appropriate.   
 
Yep.   Even the bigs have some lean times.  
 
1978 NBA finals were not on national TV
 
Then came bird and magic.
 
Look, little regionals are nice.  They fill a need for smaller FA's to survive.  
A place to handle your smallish accounts and do your business.
They make it a nice envirorment for this.
If you do 300k you can feel good about yourself.
All I ask k is that you dont get carried away.
 
(And those peanut accounts need good service also!     Its all good)
 
Just dont think you can take Chris Paul on 1 on 1. 
 
 
 

nestegg's picture
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My Regional has about the same avg annual production as Wachovia, and my office has a higher avg prod than my old Wachovia office....I guess all those small accts add up.
 
As someone who has seen both sides I can honestly say that the Wirehouse has nothing different to offer than a good regional, expect extra overhead and BS, no different products and services, no more flexability, no better pricing for clients and no better payout for brokers.

etj4588's picture
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nestegg wrote:
...the Wirehouse has nothing different to offer than a good regional, expect extra overhead and BS, no different products and services, no more flexability, no better pricing for clients...
 
And most clients now know this as well.
 
 

Moraen's picture
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WORLD PEACE wrote: [quote=
 
 
You mean the "real show" like Merrill or Smith Barney?  Where are they now?  Right, they were soooo successful at playing in the "show" that they had to have some other minor league team pick up all those contracts.  Yeah, that sounds like success to me.  Funny thing about the "show" is the fans.  Seems the fans don't like to watch the show much anymore.  Makes their stomachs hurt to think about paying those high ticket prices to get in, see their wonderful team losing the game, all the while raking in the big bucks for doing it.  Seems they'd rather see what watching AAA or even A ball is like.  Certainly those guys can't perform any worse than the big dogs.  Especially when some of the stars from the big leagues decided to voluntarily move down to AAA ball.  So record numbers of fans are now going to AAA games than the pros.   
 
You guys in pros looked more like the Harlem Globetrotters recently than a really competitive team.  Actually, I gave you too much credit.  The Washington Generals are more appropriate.   
 

Yep.   Even the bigs have some lean times.  
 
1978 NBA finals were not on national TV
 
Then came bird and magic.
 
Look, little regionals are nice.  They fill a need for smaller FA's to survive.  
A place to handle your smallish accounts and do your business.
They make it a nice envirorment for this.
If you do 300k you can feel good about yourself. [/DI
All I ask k is that you dont get carried away.
 
(And those peanut accounts need good service also!     Its all good)
 
Just dont think you can take Chris Paul on 1 on 1. 
 
 
 

I just ask that you don't think you can make on your own. You need Mommy and Daddy to make it in the world. I hope they take real good care of you at the wire. Stars are stars no matter where they are. I think it's ok that you need to use someone elses name to be successful. Really it is. Just don't get carried away and think you are good enough to survive without momma bac or daddy mssb to help you.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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WORLD PEACE wrote:
 
Yep.   Even the bigs have some lean times.  
 
1978 NBA finals were not on national TV
 
Then came bird and magic.
 
Look, little regionals are nice.  They fill a need for smaller FA's to survive.  
A place to handle your smallish accounts and do your business.
They make it a nice envirorment for this.
If you do 300k you can feel good about yourself.
All I ask k is that you dont get carried away.
 
(And those peanut accounts need good service also!     Its all good)
 
Just dont think you can take Chris Paul on 1 on 1. 
 
 
I don't know if you've been paying attention or not, but the Chris Paul's of the investment world don't work for the wires anymore.  Many of them jumped to places like Stifel when the ML ship started to stink.   
 
Your contention that doing $300K at a regional makes you a big hitter is laughable.  That doesn't even get you to Seg 4 with Jones.  I would imagine that it's not all that different at other regionals. 
 
You can keep living in this fantasy world that says the big wirehouses have a competitive advantage over the smaller regionals if you want.  But excuse me if I continue to call you delusional.  Do some research and figure out how many regionals had to get bailed out by the government, a bank, or another brokerage firm to stay alive.  Clients noticed.  Then they acted.  With their feet.  As did a lot of FAs.  And Nero fiddled while Rome burned...
 

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WP,
 
At Jones, despite having a boatload of low producers, we have at least 350 FA's producing north of about 850K.  The cutoff for going to the Managing Partners conference is $650K in transaction revenue (so not including trails).  My buddy just squeeked in this year for the first time, and he was at about 850K in total gross. 
 
In 2007, the firm averaged almost exactly 300K in production per FA, and $48mm AUM per FA.  So, that means that about half the FA's produce more than that (yes, it's not the median, so it's not exact).  If you consider how many FA's we have with less than 5 years experience, it gives you an idea of the average production of experienced FA's.
 
So I know it doesn't compare to the wires, but your assertion that 300K is "rock star" status is bunk.

iconsult100's picture
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I find the arrogance of some of the people in this industry to be completely laughable.

If you produce 300k and take home about 110k as a result, that's decent money in most parts of the country.  What gives you the right to look down on these people?  Maybe if you focused on taking care of clients, you wouldn't lose them.
 
A retail branch for a wirehouse is just a channel of distribution, that is it.  From my experience at MS, you are either the pimp or the whore.
 
 

Popeye $'s picture
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I assume based on your post you were the whore?

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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ice - I think most people still consider Jones a regional.  Even some of our wholesalers who aren't Jones specific tell us that we get lumped in with the Stifels of the industry.  I don't know what the cutoff between regional and wirehouse is, but I'd guess Jones surpassed it a while ago. 

Squash1's picture
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I agree with spiff's comments. I have similar wholesalers now(indy) as I did at Jones.

I think wholesalers either lump them with indys or regionals. They are really a category to themselves, but there is no category.

You could lump jones with Mutual Fund Store, TD Ameritrade and not be wrong.

Or you could lump them with regionals

henryhill's picture
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I thought wirehouses were based in NYC and regionals are based somewhere else.

Squash1's picture
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Well then there is only one wirehouse left.. UBS is NJ, ML is BAC which is one of the carolinas i think. WFC is what california.. So that leave Citi Morg as the only wirehouse left.

Moraen's picture
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Technically, the definition of a wirehouse is an institution whose different branches are linked by a communications system enabling them to share financial information, customer data and research.

Which pretty much makes any place with multiple branches a wirehouse.

Ha! I may be a wirehouse soon. How ironic?

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Then by that definition Jones is definitely a wirehouse.  We had telegraph wires stringing our Jones offices together back in 1960.  Its why the messages we send today on the green screens are called wires.  Ted figured that he could string a telegraph wire from point A back to STL and then build offices along the wire anywhere in between.  Ed Sr. thought that Ted was crazy and that the company would go broke before he could build those offices.
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?

nestegg's picture
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Spaceman Spiff wrote:Then by that definition Jones is definitely a wirehouse.  We had telegraph wires stringing our Jones offices together back in 1960.  Its why the messages we send today on the green screens are called wires.  Ted figured that he could string a telegraph wire from point A back to STL and then build offices along the wire anywhere in between.  Ed Sr. thought that Ted was crazy and that the company would go broke before he could build those offices.
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?You do realize most other firms used Wires too right...

Gordon Gekko's picture
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I thought the line in the sand between wires and regionals had to do with fc headcount. What that number is, I can't recall.

UNDERMINDED's picture
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Is EDJ really considered a Regional?
 
You've gotta be kidding.  If 12000 branches, all 50 states, Canada, and the UK makes us a Regional firm than I guess my understanding of a Regional was waaaay off.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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nestegg wrote: Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Then by that definition Jones is definitely a wirehouse.  We had telegraph wires stringing our Jones offices together back in 1960.  Its why the messages we send today on the green screens are called wires.  Ted figured that he could string a telegraph wire from point A back to STL and then build offices along the wire anywhere in between.  Ed Sr. thought that Ted was crazy and that the company would go broke before he could build those offices.
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?You do realize most other firms used Wires too right...
 
Yes.  I realize that Ted didn't create the telegraph wire.

2wheeledbeemer's picture
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Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?
Ummm.....Nigel Tufnel's amp?

troll's picture
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2wheeledbeemer wrote:Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?
Ummm.....Nigel Tufnel's amp?
 
Correct! Kind of... His amp had an output as well. It finally ended in Pueblo, Co. which ironicly means small town.
 
What do I win Spiff?
 
Back to the difference in business models... It seems like maybe wirehouses are centrally located in large cities and regionals are well in the regions the clients are, I am guessing. Can someone give us a run down of the traditional definitions and examples, also what these examples probably should be called with the changes over the past year or so?  

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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[quote=JAXSON It finally ended in Pueblo, Co. which ironicly means small town.
 
What do I win Spiff?
 
 
You win my very special Doug Hill picture.  It's professionally framed and matted, complete with quote from Doug on one side and his smiling face on the other.  Congrats.  That'll be $49.95 for S&H.  I take Paypal. 

troll's picture
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Take it out of your LP

burtonfinancial1's picture
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FYI- I've heard that Stifel is so buried in paperwork and crap from the mere 55 UBS offices they bought that they may be freezing FA hiring for 3-6 mos. A recruiter who said he has recruited into Stifel for a year told me that today.   One less regional in the game for Q3 and Q4? 

wellschovia's picture
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The transfer process may slow up a bit to make sure they do the UBS transition correctly. I'd rather see controlled growth than uncontrolled growth. Stifel must be doing something right or else they wouldn't attract so many new brokers. 

WORLD PEACE's picture
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2wheeledbeemer wrote:Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Bonus question - One end of the telegraph was in STL.  Where was the other end of the line?
Ummm.....Nigel Tufnel's amp?
 
The other end of the line was here:  (and I REALLY mean "end of the line") :
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Hg-IRZk4D0

FABroker1999's picture
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It goes to 11..most only go to 10.

nestegg's picture
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burtonfinancial1 wrote:FYI- I've heard that Stifel is so buried in paperwork and crap from the mere 55 UBS offices they bought that they may be freezing FA hiring for 3-6 mos. A recruiter who said he has recruited into Stifel for a year told me that today.   One less regional in the game for Q3 and Q4? 
Nah they are just pickier now, and it probably depends on the region or office. I know our office is still going after recruits but only bigger fish right now.

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