[quote=babbling looney]

BL, usually you give good advice, as you have here, but WHY ON EARTH do you assume all this hasn't already taken place???  Do you think you're the only professional around here?

This isn't bush league stuff, so OF COURSE there are other things going on. 

No need to yell. 

Not yelling, just using bold to help readers differentiate who is talking.  YELLING LOOKS LIKE THIS.

Of course I don't think that I am the only professional around here.  I do think that I have been doing this much longer than many of you and have had the experience of being in the position of evaluating businesses and granting loans (or not granting) to existing and new businesses and then monitoring those loans and businesses for ongoing ability to repay.  I have seen many businesses fail because of a lack of planning and a refusal to take professional advice.

That's great.  Our commercial folks do the same thing every day.  We work as a TEAM.

You are a bank investment rep. I am not denigrating you for that at all. I too was a bank investment rep for some time.  As a bank platform employee, why in the world are you even involved with this client and his business ambitions and business planning? 

Because, believe me or not I don't care, my role in MY financial institution is much greater than "the annuity guy" or "the mutual fund guy."  I work VERY closely with the commercial lending dept, and they rely on the to provide the best strategies for their customers.  That takes taxes into consideration.

Not to be crass, other than just being a helpful person, what is in it for you?  How are you going to be making money from this client?  This is your main function for the bank.  Your function to the client is advising him on investments.  I would assume your pay off is by keeping his 401K money invested with you so you can make commissions, while helping him figure out another way to finance his business and then referring him to some one in that arena.

I am 7 and 66, so sure I get paid by getting assets in the door.  BUT I CARE MORE ABOUT THE CLIENT GETTING THE BEST POSSIBLE SOLUTION.  That is my job foremost.  I have very little pressure regarding numbers, as my numbers are already above expectations.  I can AFFORD to find the best solution for our clients.

Keeping investment advice separate from financial planning, which includes his business ambitions, is the reason we have had so much regulation and new rules recently imposed.

I have a Series 66, so why couldn't I do financial planning if I chose to?  Regardless, financial advice is dispensed from anyone and everyone anyway, from the State Farm guy, to the next door neighbor.  At least if they get it from me they can trust it is correct.

[quote=joedabrkr] [quote=BankFC][quote=babbling looney]

It may be foolish to just invest your money in ONE company, but not neccessarily ONE's OWN company.

Have you ever met many successful business owners??? 

It is actually more foolish to invest in your own company without the advice and oversight of another professional. 

[/quote]

BL, usually you give good advice, as you have here, but WHY ON EARTH do you assume all this hasn't already taken place???  Do you think you're the only professional around here?

This isn't bush league stuff, so OF COURSE there are other things going on. 

Just because I didn't take the time to intimately detail every aspect of everything that is going on with this client, you assume we're just flying by the seat of our pants???? 

With all respect, stop jumping to conclusions...

I simply was putting out the feelers to see if many others were running into this type of business, and as is par for the course, this forum responded with a bunch of "experts" giving specific recommendations with VERY LITTLE knowledge of the client.

It's easy to tell who the true professionals are on this board from the pretenders, newbies, and morons. 

Once again, it makes me realize why so many folks I meet have trust issues with brokers.  So many brokers just think they know it all. 

I wish they tested LISTENING on the series 7.

I appreciate the other responses that weren't client specific, and I am not going to waste any more time on this thread (I suppose I'll waste it elsewhere  ).

[/quote]

I understand your frustration but after all you did ask this question on a PUBLIC forum.  Nobody is forcing you to read all the "irrelevant" posts.
[/quote]

Joe, you're right.  I shouldn't expect much out of this forum. 

However, I am "forced" to read the piles of "irrelevant" posts in order to find the one or to good nuggets of info in any given thread.

Like you said, it's a public forum. 

to = two

[quote=joedabrkr] [quote=TexasRep]

>>Texas: I don't know if a company 401K would allow a partial roll out of funds or not. The issue that I have seen with most (not all) company 401K plans after you have retired or left the company is that they don't want you to keep your money in the plan and sometimes force you to roll the account out.  If you have borrowed on the company plan, you might not be able to roll that loan into a new individual 401K if you have already borrowed there due to IRS rules.  The client may have to face a distribution event on the money borrowed from the company plan, if he is forced to close or roll the company plan out.  Not a good thing.

BL- aren't company 401k's like a box of chocolates? never know what you're gonna' get--

most $450k 401k accounts i've run across, i've practically needed a court order to get them to release-

i'd rollover $100k into a solo 401k if possible, then borrow $50k from it, rollover $250 into an IRA, keep $100k at the old 401k, ONLY IF i could then borrow another $50k from it-  IF i really needed the $100k.

but since they are all different - you should check it out and see if it's possible first--

[/quote]

If you're having a problem getting them transferred in then you need to learn how to handle the transfers better...it's not that hard once you get the right paperwork in your client's hands.....in my experience.
[/quote]

gosh thanks for that, guru-

i'm getting the money, but at times it's taken awhile or a few phone calls (not more paperwork or signatures) -- that has just been my experience vs. BL's: ".....they don't want you to keep your money in the plan and sometimes force you to roll the account out...."

but when you deal w/ the company 401k plan administrators, prepare to deal with almost any curve ball imaginable--

I know this can be frustrating with all the insulting posts and such,
but I learned a new trick here… I LOVE the idea of rollover to solo K
and borrow from yourself… BRILLIANT!  Thanks folks, I love this
place!

[quote=TexasRep][quote=joedabrkr] [quote=TexasRep]

>>Texas: I don't know if a company 401K would allow a partial roll out of funds or not. The issue that I have seen with most (not all) company 401K plans after you have retired or left the company is that they don't want you to keep your money in the plan and sometimes force you to roll the account out.  If you have borrowed on the company plan, you might not be able to roll that loan into a new individual 401K if you have already borrowed there due to IRS rules.  The client may have to face a distribution event on the money borrowed from the company plan, if he is forced to close or roll the company plan out.  Not a good thing.

BL- aren't company 401k's like a box of chocolates? never know what you're gonna' get--

most $450k 401k accounts i've run across, i've practically needed a court order to get them to release-

i'd rollover $100k into a solo 401k if possible, then borrow $50k from it, rollover $250 into an IRA, keep $100k at the old 401k, ONLY IF i could then borrow another $50k from it-  IF i really needed the $100k.

but since they are all different - you should check it out and see if it's possible first--

[/quote]

If you're having a problem getting them transferred in then you need to learn how to handle the transfers better...it's not that hard once you get the right paperwork in your client's hands.....in my experience.
[/quote]

gosh thanks for that, guru-

i'm getting the money, but at times it's taken awhile or a few phone calls (not more paperwork or signatures) -- that has just been my experience vs. BL's: ".....they don't want you to keep your money in the plan and sometimes force you to roll the account out...."

but when you deal w/ the company 401k plan administrators, prepare to deal with almost any curve ball imaginable--

[quote=Ready2Jump]I know this can be frustrating with all the insulting posts and such, but I learned a new trick here... I LOVE the idea of rollover to solo K and borrow from yourself... BRILLIANT!  Thanks folks, I love this place! [/quote]

if you're gonna' blow smoke ...why bother?

if you're gonna' insult, just to make yourself feel better...why bother?

if you've got a legitimate counter that may ultimately educate and/or inform, you've got to go with it, the person who ends up learning the most, may be yourself--- and that's why this forum is here.

[quote=joedabrkr]
mea culpa....admittedly my comment wasn't the most constructive....

I too have found you must follow up on EVERYTHING to make sure that the paperwork is processed correctly and promptly.  A couple thoughts-

I always take notes on conversations, ask when $$ are expected, and follow up with the administrator very politely but firmly within a few days of expected date if no check has arrived.
Lately I've been drafting a cover letter for clients to sign explaining to administrator/custodian that I am acting on their behalf to facilitate the transfer, and that they should give me whatever information or forms are necessary to make that happen promptly.  Only started using it recently, but it seems to work.
I try to get checks sent directly to my branch for deposit, to avoid delays by passing through the client's hands, or the potential that the check could get lost in the mail.
Sometimes I have also included a return Fedex envelope with paperwork, but haven't used this strategy regularly.
Often with bigger company plans the entire distribution process can be handled on the phone.  Try to remember to have your client call and ask this question.  Speeds up the process quite a bit.
[/quote]

excellent post-

some of the VERY big plans allow you to txfer with a few keystrokes and clicks of the mouse-

the mom & pop's tho seem to make it harder to pull money out of by adding this inane form and that repetitious signature, it almost seems like some of them don't want to release the likes of $100k to $500k too easily-

Seems like all the Fidelity plans around here allow for transfers right over the phone.  I just turn on the speaker, tell the Fidelity folks that the client is listening in and let the client confirm my instructions.  The Fidelity folks are very polite and this has worked like a charm every time I’ve used it.

[quote=TexasRep]...the person who ends up learning the most, may be yourself--- and that's why this forum is here.[/quote]

Absolutely.  I'm not too proud to admit that I learned something here yesterday.  Now I have the always pleasant task of informing the client's CPA that I'm questioning his tax advice...yippee...

[quote=Indyone]

[quote=TexasRep]…the person who ends up learning the most, may be yourself— and that’s why this forum is here.[/quote]

Absolutely.  I'm not too proud to admit that I learned something here yesterday.  Now I have the always pleasant task of informing the client's CPA that I'm questioning his tax advice...yippee...