Merrill Retention
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Man I read some of the stuff one here and I start cracking up..but this has to be the tops. "Rainmaker" LOL!! I am not sure any broker is a rainmaker when firms pay analysts 7 figures to write b.s stock reports..Abby Cohen at GS makes 7 million a year and she got demoted for being wrong so often..She is basically being paid her contract just to stay quiet. A firm makes more on a random overnight block trade than what a broker brings in for them in a year..Sure most guys get that they are a tiny speck of dirt in the big picture for these places, but FB your Rainmaker line is classic, I have sent it to over 100 guys and everyone is laughing.I think that anyone over 500K is a rainmaker. I notice that you didn’t answer the question. Most will never do that in their career and just because it is average at ML doesn’t mean other firms don’t covet us. In fact, ML offered me 120% of my T12 to take my business there. Laugh all you want, but I’m the one laughing.
No offense Ferris, but it's this type of arrogance that played a huge role in the demise of the financial markets. After everything that has happened there is zero accountability and absolutely no humility.
Fritz: It's a pretty poor comparison b/w a financial advisor and Abby Cohen, or anyone at GS for that matter. GS has more intellectual capital than any other firm on Wall Street. I think Abby is awful, but it's very difficult for analysts to make predictions when companies are not fully disclosing their books, and only the top 1-3% of analysts are making 7 digit salaries. Meredith Whitney at Oppenheimer and David Rosenberg at ML have been two of the best over the last 18 months.
[quote=Sellout21]
No offense Ferris, but it's this type of arrogance that played a huge role in the demise of the financial markets. After everything that has happened there is zero accountability and absolutely no humility.
Fritz: It's a pretty poor comparison b/w a financial advisor and Abby Cohen, or anyone at GS for that matter. GS has more intellectual capital than any other firm on Wall Street. I think Abby is awful, but it's very difficult for analysts to make predictions when companies are not fully disclosing their books, and only the top 1-3% of analysts are making 7 digit salaries. Meredith Whitney at Oppenheimer and David Rosenberg at ML have been two of the best over the last 18 months.
[/quote] No offense taken, but a broker doing 800K calling himself a rainmaker is a joke. My branch has settled two trading disputes this year for almost double that. We also paid a guy 200% of his T-12 16 months ago $2.3 million up front and the guy has not cracked 10K one month since he has been at our place. My point is in the scale of this biz and the way firms blow money, its hard for one broker to be a "rainmaker."I find it hard to believe that anybody’s TOP clients were up in 2008, unless they brought in a lot of cash at some point during the year, and you consider a higher balance in the brokerage account on 12.31.08 UP. Not trying to ignite a fight, just voicing an opinion. For what it is worth, in the Dictionary we use on this site, I am a Rainmaker.
Fritz; are you telling us that a guy who had a T-12 doing 1.15mm did less that 120K last year (2.3 million =200% Upfront)?? That is staggering to hear!! How is that humanly possible. If that is true, I am not sure if the guy that got brought over is an idiot or a genius.
No one is irreplaceable in this business.
On another note: Why all the ML bashing? Say what you want about the firm, all firms and the vast majority of advisors all use ML as the example. Whether it's retention bonuses, comp plans, # of assets, # of brokers, etc..., people always look at ML for precedent. I'm by no means saying they do everything right, but you can't deny they usually set the standard when it comes to retail brokerage.
Wow…gutsy call if that is the case. Well done! I was in the same boat up until the end of May, then I got about 50% back in the market. Needless to say, my Top Clients were not up in 2008.
Why all the Ml bashing?? Probably for a couple reasons. Most ML guys I have met are rather egotistical, and border line elitist. Another reason is that a lot of people in this world like to see other fail. One last reason is that I would wager that the ML/WS ratio for this message board is around 1:5.
Congrats to you all on being rainmakers!!! LOL
On another more serious note…Ferris you bring up a good point that i am surprised has not been brought up front to the general public yet. With Citi and BAC getting all this money and guarantees from Uncle Sam, it is only a matter of time before some newshound gets a hold of the retention announcements and runs with it. And that is going to cause all kinds of outrage. Should be interesting.
My last comment is…how th freak does Ken Lewis have a job? He makes Vikram, Chuck Prince, et al, look like geniuses.
ML is the one place i wouldnt go right now. That situation is scary.
"idiot or genius" That's funny, the topic has come on several occasions at the branch. Think everyone to a man in the office says genius!! Back in 2000 (top of the marketFritz; are you telling us that a guy who had a T-12 doing 1.15mm did less that 120K last year (2.3 million =200% Upfront)?? That is staggering to hear!! How is that humanly possible. If that is true, I am not sure if the guy that got brought over is an idiot or a genius.
)was at a different firm and about 8 or 9 guys came over with T-12 of 7 figures and NONE of them ever did 300 again before their 5 year contract was up. From my limited sample, maybe 25 guys I dont think 20 of the guys even came close to a breakeven deal for the new firm, it makes me wonder how firms continue to pay like they do, maybe it works out more often at other places??
I guess I would have to wonder what it would be like to go to work every day, and you rboss thinks you basically stole from him. How could you gather up the stones to even show up everyday (that is a rhetorical question, I know he has 2.3 million reasons). In all seriousness, what it is it like for him at work??
Fritz,
I echo Duster's question, "how can that be possible?" Did they do nothing once moved? Were they at the end of careers? I would think that whatever formula they used to get to 7 figures would still be viable.“How could you gather up the stones to even show up everyday (that is a rhetorical question, I know he has 2.3 million reasons).”
I kind of wonder also what it would be like to be that far off, I have seen so many guys come that have dropped 50% from the alleged numbers, but this one pretty severe. As to whats it like for him, no one really says anything he puts in his 6 hours a day and goes home. One guy back in 2000 was supposedly around 500k at PRU and his top month at the new place about 4K. He lasted about 18 months and they just told him to go home. From what I've seen most guys leave when they know they will not hit the t-12 for a long time if ever, or if they are about to lose a big account...As long as you show up not sure what the firms can do when guys dont pan out??The real question is how come the manager who recruited them still has a job?? In my opinion, most of management is completely worthless and they are the ones who should be held accountable. They are the ones getting big bonuses when things go well, but are the first to start pointing fingers when it gets ugly.
[quote=fritz] “How could you gather up the stones to even show up everyday (that is a rhetorical question, I know he has 2.3 million reasons).”
I kind of wonder also what it would be like to be that far off, I have seen so many guys come that have dropped 50% from the alleged numbers, but this one pretty severe. As to whats it like for him, no one really says anything he puts in his 6 hours a day and goes home. One guy back in 2000 was supposedly around 500k at PRU and his top month at the new place about 4K. He lasted about 18 months and they just told him to go home. From what I've seen most guys leave when they know they will not hit the t-12 for a long time if ever, or if they are about to lose a big account...As long as you show up not sure what the firms can do when guys dont pan out??[/quote]If someone drops that low and never rebuilds they were either a one-trick pony at their old shop or they just gave up. If they had the talent to build a 500k or 1mil book, then they had the ability to rebuild it too.
CNBC and Bloomberg have had a decent amount of coverage on the retention bonuses. Most clients realize that salesmen are an extremely large part of the profitability of any organization. The bonuses can somewhat be rationalized to keep top talent, and your average person would much rather see the foot soldiers getting bonused rather than the executive management.
I don't know if Ken Lewis is an idiot or a genius, but he's got the government by the balls now. There's no way they will let Bank of America fail, and Lewis knows it. If the government is giving out money, BOA wants the lion's share. Lewis knows he can gain even more market share with a government backstop. Warren Buffett was early too, but everyone calls him the "Oracle".FB not hoping nothing..if thats what you think its wrong. Just saying heard over 2 months ago WFC does not want to pay retention. If they do and you get some good for you. Dont know that saying what has happened so far makes me dumb? Think I'd feel dumber if i said something was coming and it has not in 100 days.Sellout21 - Arrogance? I conservatively manage my client money. I didn’t create financial instruments that were crap and then get them AAA rated NOR did I sell them to my clients. My book consists of treasury bonds, muni bonds, and conservative stocks/mutual funds. My top clients were all UP for 2008.
Fritz - I doubt you know 10 guys, let alone 100 and those 10 are the ones you happen to know at the local gay bar. If our firms don’t need guys producing over 500K and can live off a random overnight block trade then maybe they should heed your advice and just fire all of us. You have expressed some dumb shit here before, but that takes the cake. That plus actively HOPING that no WS/AGE brokers get retention make you a jerkoff. Where’s Put Trader, he actually made more sense than you.
We also paid a guy 200% of his T-12 16 months ago $2.3 million up front
and the guy has not cracked 10K one month since he has been at our
place.
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Thats absurd. What did the guy just stop working??? He’d F’d once the money runs out. Fact they ought to fire him right now and get back what they can if he has any left. On the other hand, its not out of the question that the guy is a genius, managed to double the money in the mkt and basically if they want to fire him and demand back the money, he’s in great shape.