very good points
thanks for all your feedbacks

But you do, in fact, need to have decent wheels to do this job.

I drive a $50,000 mercedes for the reasons others described - it's nice, but it's not TOO nice.

In order to build rapport - you must generally look like your clients - not wealthier, but of the same social class and income. If your clients make more than $300k a year and have investment assets north of $2 million, they are going to drive something relatively new and expensive. Even that Ford F150 is going to be a NICE, new truck.

Most corporate executives, management consultants, affluent attorneys, specialist physicians, senior engineers and financial types are going to do business in a wirehouse or boutique firm. We wear suits and meet face to face.  If you saw us, you'd assume that WE were a corporate executive, banker or doctor. We never describe ourselves as "Financial Planners" - too downmarket. "Financial Advisor" or "Wealth Manager" or "Private Banker" are the terms that we're going to use to decribe ourselves.

If you're in a wirehouse or a boutique, whether you can afford to or not (and when you're a rookie, you can't) you must dress and drive the part. No C-level corporate executive of a public firm is going to employ a "Wealth Manager" who drives a 1990 Hyundai Charade and wears a $200 suits. He will not sign an ACAT worth $2 million. No one will.

The Suze Orman - ish "Financial Planner" - types are generally catering to a much more frugal crowd - either by preference or necessity. Their clients are blue and grey collar employees, small business owners, GP physicians, nurses - people who never had the company fly them first class or who went on a roadshow. Their clients are people who've saved their entire lives or who cashed out the pension plan in a lump sum. Sometimes they're young families who make little money, but want to know how to save for retirement. Suze can dress from Macy's and never have to worry about looking "poor" to their clients. She'll always seem successful - it's relative.

Big hat.  No cattle.

You are probably correct in your assessment if you are going after the high income crowd.  You are completely incorrect if you are going after the high networth crowd.  So many of these folks are business owners who have no outward signs of wealth.

san fran broker Praise the lord! For sure a new PFA who goes to any professionals home with a 93 Ford or a 88 Chevy is going to have a serious confidence issue. Of course there are some strong people out there who can overcome this, but when you drive a nice car you feel good... Also it can help with marketing!

Anonymous.. Man I work with blue collar crown/owners and I don't think they have an issue with a financial advisor who at least looks the part. Of course you have to sell/advise the client, but if I pulled up in a beat up 93 pickup??

I don’t recall anyone advocating that you should drive a beat up pickup.  If you want a $50,000 car, go buy one.  If you think that it will help your business, you are dreaming.

[quote=san fran broker]

But you do, in fact, need to have decent wheels to do this job.

I drive a $50,000 mercedes for the reasons others described - it's nice, but it's not TOO nice.

In order to build rapport - you must generally look like your clients - not wealthier, but of the same social class and income. If your clients make more than $300k a year and have investment assets north of $2 million, they are going to drive something relatively new and expensive. Even that Ford F150 is going to be a NICE, new truck.

Most corporate executives, management consultants, affluent attorneys, specialist physicians, senior engineers and financial types are going to do business in a wirehouse or boutique firm. We wear suits and meet face to face.  If you saw us, you'd assume that WE were a corporate executive, banker or doctor. We never describe ourselves as "Financial Planners" - too downmarket. "Financial Advisor" or "Wealth Manager" or "Private Banker" are the terms that we're going to use to decribe ourselves.

If you're in a wirehouse or a boutique, whether you can afford to or not (and when you're a rookie, you can't) you must dress and drive the part. No C-level corporate executive of a public firm is going to employ a "Wealth Manager" who drives a 1990 Hyundai Charade and wears a $200 suits. He will not sign an ACAT worth $2 million. No one will.

The Suze Orman - ish "Financial Planner" - types are generally catering to a much more frugal crowd - either by preference or necessity. Their clients are blue and grey collar employees, small business owners, GP physicians, nurses - people who never had the company fly them first class or who went on a roadshow. Their clients are people who've saved their entire lives or who cashed out the pension plan in a lump sum. Sometimes they're young families who make little money, but want to know how to save for retirement. Suze can dress from Macy's and never have to worry about looking "poor" to their clients. She'll always seem successful - it's relative.

[/quote]

'Tis true, 'tis true 

Okay so when I pull up to the Democratic town committee in my 97 Grand Am... Why not pull up in a nice 7 series 95 BMW... That is my point. Not 50k or 200k, but instead of something low end go premium and - 5 years for 15k.

If your inside a building and you never go to see customers then drive a Chevette to save your money and be debt free. Also all employees would get one hell of a laugh. Actaully go with the Gremlin, I love that freaking car!

[quote=san fran broker]In order to build rapport - you must generally
look like your clients - not wealthier, but of the same social class
and income. [/quote]



Well said.  Reading this thread has caused me to chuckle, so I
decided to jump in.  As far as a Lambo, its okay if your clients
are Snoop Dog, Shaq or Larry Flint.



I have a client who is a car collector (daily driver is a Cayenne
Turbo).  We disagree about whether it is a good investment, but I
have to acknowledge that his cars offer HIM a level of satisfaction he
doesn’t get from his brokerage statement. 



He invited me to one of the larger car club functions…Ferrari. I have
to admit, it was a financial advisor’s wet dream…200 affluent
individuals at one spot.  I’m tempted to tap my HELOC to get one
so I can be on the inside.  



Now, I need to convince the wife.

Only *hacks* drive anything less than 'Lambo's'.

c'mon man do you know how many people actually drive $150k plus sports cars?  The maintenance costs alone are enough to keep someone making $200k a year in the poor house (assuming they have other real life expenses and a commensurate lifestyle with their income). In addition owning a 'lambo' or other sports car is not necessarily proof that someone is 'rich'.  What's you definition of rich anyway?  Sorry to break it to you but I don't see someone making $200k as rich (if that's the only qualifying factor).  I've known guys who make $500k a year with $1,000,000 homes driving higher end cars (sorry no 'lambo's') that I don't consider rich by any means (although they are certainly affluent). 

I don't start to consider someone rich until they are at a place where they don't have to work to afford their affluent lifestyle, maybe it looks something like $10 million producing $400k plus in income yearly (and this is at the low end).  These guys are probably not driving 'Lambo's' to say the least.

The plain truth is that very few financial advisors are at this level.  The 'richest' brokers I've known were in their 70's or 80's worth approximatley $10 million (received through years of staying with Dean Witter and getting stock grants through multiple acquisitions) and drove middle of the road vehicles.  There were 3 if these guys at my Morgan Stanley branch.  The thing is that they were able to accumulate that sum by not driving 'Lambo's', Benleys, Rolls Royce's etc.... and living with in their means (which was a pretty nice lifestyle by the way, not extravagant though).

What? No one drives a Yugo?

[quote=skeedaddy2]

Well said.  Reading this thread has caused me to chuckle, so I
decided to jump in.  As far as a Lambo, its okay if your clients
are Snoop Dog, Shaq or Larry Flint.
[/quote]



Haha…actually Shaq, Eminem, and 50 Cent are all clients of ML. 
Sometimes when I’m bored I’ll search through the ‘existing relationship
directory’…I don’t think I would even want to be the FA for 50 cent
though; imagine doing a review with him at the end of '02 

I’m down with that…DAWG!

Judging a book by it's cover, always interesting.

A couple years ago I was the guest speaker some place, Rotary, Lions, I don't recall exactly which group. But I remember what happened. I'd given my talk and was taking questions when some clown asked why I was driving a Honda Accord. "Well the Benz is in the shop", I joked. Then I continued "Seriously, I own 12 vehicles. None are leased or financed, 7 are for my personal use and 5 are driven by my children. They range from brand new to a few years old.  I could have come tonite in my Mustang Cobra convertible or on my BMW K1200LT motorcycle, but I didn't think it would be appropriate. Likewise, I could have ridden over on my Honda scooter, but I don't like riding it after dark. If we were at a park or fairground I might have brought my motorhome, but this restaurant doesn't have a big enough parking lot for my 40 foot diesel pusher. And if you guys were all farmers maybe I would have shown up in my Dodge Ram Pickup truck. But, tonite I decided to drive my Honda Accord. It's a perfectly good car and I enjoy driving it, more so than my Jeep Grand Cherokee. Does that answer your question?

Those might not have been my exact words, I didn't write them down. But it's close and I did get all my cars into the answer.

I've learned that judging a book by it's cover is a huge mistake. Yet, there are those who do it. If not driving the top of the line car with the blue propeller insignia on the grill cost me a client, so be it. So far, it hasn't been an issue.

A car is not going to land you a client. Trust will land you a client.

How is a client going to know what kind of car I drive anyways? Our biggest producer in our company drives a mini-van, he must be a hack though. A humble hack though right?

If you appeal to a certain social class, i am sure you are one of them anways. Why change your ways if that is not even the cirlce you run around with?

I never have once met someone and been like WOW, he drives a high end benz. I have to do business with him. Heck for all you know, he could be dealing drugs, fraud, churning , ect. You get my drift.

Besides I only do business with Carver Yacht owners, and maybe a Boston Whaler owner!

True…  Toyota is awesome! Liquid Assets should I get a mini van?

All I am saying is that for a new PFA everything helps… First impression is important… Confidence is important and looking your best is important. Now an experienced RR could pull off driving a Pinto, but a new RR with limited knowledge needs every bit of help. 

Actually if a new PFA had something really nice you would have to question how smart the “kid” or “rookie” is. Last thing they need to worry about is a $500 dollar car payment and the $400 insurance payment.

But I would much rather drive a 10 year old 7 series then a 5 year old anything American.

tjc: I could almost live off the interest on the value of the stuff you own/drive. Guess I don’t get the point of 12 vehicles.

12 vehicles does seem excessive. We only have 6.  Of course almost all of them are classic type vehicles for several reasons. We belong to a hot rod/classic car club. Older vehicles don't need to be smogged and can be brought up to modern standards without the high DMV registration costs of a new vehicle. Older vehicles don't have computerized crap to fail on you every time you turn around.

For example our 1967 Chevy Stepside costs less than $80 a year to register.  We upgraded with a Chevy 350 performance Crate Motor, Hooker Headers, FlowMaster dual exhausts, lowered front end with power disk brakes, power steering, 700r4 automatic transmission, Chevy Rally Rims all around, BF Goodrich radial T/As, lowered two inches all around, rocking stereo/cd player, bucket seats, fiberglass bed cover and a nice green paint job to match the original factory color.  We call him Pickles.   If  you don't think that turns heads when I drive it (after my husband and I fight over who's turn it is), then let me tell you about our 1957 Chevy flat bed (hubby's work truck), or 71 GMC or 72 K5 Blazer or 68 Galaxie fastback.  We just lost out on bidding on a 47 Buick 2 door sedan that I wanted to trick out. :-( Can you tell I like cars?

My daily driver is a boring new model Blazer which is the standard type of vehicle in this area.  

Actually the advice about you blending in with your dress and vehicles is good advice. And the point about belonging to a car club is a very good one.  People who have the discretionary money to put a 12,000 paint job on their classic hot rod, have other money too.  But don't join any club just to get into the group, you must be passionate about the clubs interests whether it is Rotary, Garden Club or Hot Rod club.  The members will know if you are a phoney.

Oh Yeah...One more big advantage of older vehicles.  You can't be cited for a seat belt ticket.....they don't have any.    Take that California  "Click it or Ticket campaign".  Our little way of sticking it to the man.

We do have after market seat belts in the 67 Stepside and the K5 Blazer.  But we don't have to if we don't want to.  Neeener neeener.

[quote=Revealer]tjc: I could almost live off the interest on the value of the stuff you own/drive. Guess I don't get the point of 12 vehicles.[/quote]

Let's break it down. Two daily drivers, the Honda and the Jeep. The Jeep does duty as a tow vehicle for one of our boats. I need its 6500 pound towing capability. It also serves to get us to off road kayak and canoe locations. Another reason we own a Jeep and a Honda is that both can be flat towed behind the motorhome. That means we don't need a trailer to pull them. The BMW K1200LTC motorcycle is my Ironbutt machine. Look'em up at www.ironbutt.com. The Honda Reflex scooter is an around town, go get the milk bike. Lots of fun to ride! The Motorhome is a recreational vehicle that we use for travel and to support the boat racing we still occasionally do. The Cobra was a self explanatory middle age crisis machine, and once I burned the rear tires off the thing I sold it, melted tires and all. I bought the pick up truck because at the time I was doing serious renovations to my house. I did most of the work myself. Things like rebuilding an 1100 square foot triple level deck from the ground up. I got tired of being burned time and time again by a lumber yard that couldn't keep its delivery promises. One day, after planning yet another day off to work on the house, and waiting for a load of lumber and supplies that didn't show up, I drove to the nearest car dealer and bought the truck. I kept the truck for three years and sold it. I regret selling it, because it was such a handy vehicle to have around. So right now I'm down to five personal vehicles. Of course my wife drives one. We work together and usually commute to the office together in the 03 Accord which now has 92000 miles on it. If she has appointments out of the office and I don't, I take one of the bikes. In really bad weather, I take the Jeep. The other five vehicles are driven by my children, and even though technically speaking I own them, I consider those car as theirs. If you don't get the point of helping out your kids, I can't explain it to you. I have four kids. I help them every chance I get. I enjoy helping my kids. In fact, it is one of the forces driving me. No one helped me. I started at the bottom with nothing. One of my goals was to help my kids start at a higher level. That I'm able to do it is testimony to the rewards that await anyone willing to gut this business out and do what it takes to succeed.

And sometimes the math behind doing things isn't obvious. For example buying an $18000  pickup truck might seem like a stupid waste of money. Yet it paid for itself with just the deck job. The low estimate on a contractor doing the deck was just over $30,000. I was able to do the deck myself for about $8000 in materials. I sold the truck for $11,000. Adding the $7000 depreciation to the cost of the deck and I'm out of pocket $15,000 on the deck. Of course the truck was a useful tool in many more projects around the house. So, by my way of thinking, it wasn't a stupid purchase.

Actually, I agree with you, cars are a stupid way to spend money. Thus the Accord instead of a Benz, and the Jeep instead of an LX470.

The point of my post was to show that judging one by the vehicle they drive is a mistake.

[quote=babbling looney]

Actually the advice about you blending in with your dress and vehicles is good advice. And the point about belonging to a car club is a very good one.  People who have the discretionary money to put a 12,000 paint job on their classic hot rod, have other money too.  But don't join any club just to get into the group, you must be passionate about the clubs interests whether it is Rotary, Garden Club or Hot Rod club.  The members will know if you are a phoney.

[/quote]

BL, exactly right about joining a club for the right reasons. I like your choice of wheels.

For any rookies reading this. If you do join a service club, Rotary, Lions etc, don't solicite business. Be a hard worker for the club's cause and show'em you care. The business will come to you.