My guess was that the guy working at T is making $80K. Now, 80K anyplace else in the world is pretty good, but at T he's got an incredible health plan and that 401k punch. I'd say the combination is worth at least $15K a year over having NO HEALTHCARE and NO 401K at Jones. Placing that at $95K, he's out over $100K in a three year period.

(If he's making $40K at a big box, he's not likely to be a type A, go gettem personality that would hit standards at Jones. I'm not seeing that as a reasonable possiblity)

And let me repeat ... if you had a client who had a 1 in 100 chance of making money on a deal, but stood to definitely lose not a little money but $100K on the front end and you'd sell him that deal? What you are writing is LITERALLY an effort to minimize the truth and obscure the likelihood of what will happen. You're saying taking the risk out of the equation, something you'd NEVER, EVER do in the investment world. Even if the amount to be lost was $30K (not to mention lifestyle or anything else) , you'd never make that deal. I know you wouldn't Spiff, because you're a good guy and a great Joneser.

I actually make roughly $60-$65k a year at the big box.  So basically right in the middle of both of your estimates.  Health plan is not an issue since my wife has amazing coverage for both of us.  Really all I am losing in the 401k match is about $2k a year.  Once again, that isn't a good thing but it isn't a deal breaker. 

Lock, I think you were so ready to pounce on EDJ's benefits that you didn't fully read my scenerio.  I do appreciate both sides of the argument so don't get me wrong.  Will I be leaving some money on the table in the short-term?  No doubt.  For me it is worth it because I WANT TO BE A FINANCIAL ADVISOR.  I don't want to be in retail with crappy hours and always working weekends and holidays.  I would LOVE to put in long hours when the quality and amount of my work is reflected in compensation.  In the FA world, working long hours and weekends is to YOUR benefit.  In retail, working long hours and weekends gets you nothing additional in return (I'm on salary).  Also, I have zero passion for what I currently do.  I just happened to start as a seasonal employee 4 years back and quickly worked my way up by taking pride in my work.  Lately I've done a lot of thinking about what I want to do for a living because I have always viewed my current job as a stop-gap.  I always thought I'd just come up with a great idea some day and start my own business.  Recently it has become very clear to me that I have passion for two primary things:  Sports and Personal Finance. 

The bottom line is, even if being a financial advisor only paid $65k a year I would still want to do it.  Granted, I've never actually been a FA before so it may be hard to believe that I know this is what I want to do with my life.  I know that I am INCREDIBLY interested and am taking the steps to make it become a reality.  Maybe some don't think Jones is the right route, but everything I've heard seems to be that it is a great place to start....at the very least.

JI ... congratulations. You've found the job of your dreams. Make it yours.

Do keep this in mind that it's not a job you can make $65000 a year at least, not at EDJ. But it doesn't seem like that will be a problem. Good luck.

Lock - I'm having a difficult time following your logic in this discussion. 

1) Jones does have healthcare.  It's not paid for by the firm, but there aren't many of those left in the world. 

2) He could absolutely make $65K his first year at Jones.  The median W-2 income for first year FAs is $66K, according to the Jones info on our intranet.  The number I used previously was what you would make if you were ONLY at 100% of standard.  Successful FAs won't go below 100% of standard until they're 2-3 years out, if they ever do. 

3) On your 1 in 100 scenario - I missed the 1 in 100 part, so you're correct, I wouldn't take that bet with my client's money.  However, we're not talking about client's money and investing.  We're talking about a guy who is determined to get somewhere, knows or at least believes he knows the odds and challenges, and is willing to trade his salaried $65K a year job for one that might not get him there the first year or two, but over the long run has the potential to double and triple that number. 

So, his choice is to keep working at Best Buy, we'll keep guessing until we get it right, making $65K, or take a chance to improve his life.  And not just the financial part of it.  He might actually get to sit on his couch on Sundays and watch football instead of going to work selling TVs to people who want to watch football.  I'd say take the chance.  Best Buy, or some other similar job, will be there if he can't cut it.   

Some of your comments are really quite comical. Makes me wonder if you use a writer, or come up with this stuff yourself.

Really? Jones offers health insurance? How many newbie reps in your area could actually afford family coverage on that mythical $5K gross a month? Yeah ... everyone using their wife's, just like my region. Saying you offer health insurance is like telling us we could advertise in the WSJ. If, of course, you have enough money.

FWIW ... I'm highly skeptical of national median numbers that don't bear out regionally. For instance in my three years there likely was two or three guys altogether that hit $66K. Makes me wonder if the numbers aren't skewed to survivor bias (only those FAs that completed a year?) or fail to take into account larger standard deviations/regional bias (making $66K on Long Island/Boston/SF is veritably failing).

You might want to check out the unemployment lines, Spiff. I don't think much of America shares your opinion that "some other similar job, will be there if he can't cut it". That's almost laughable and understandable coming from the perspective of someone that makes $130000 to $150000 a year. "We're not talking about a client's money and investing" ... no Spiff, you're talking about something much, much more valuable and you should honestly approach it with more respect and take even less risk with it. You're talking about his complete life, his livelihood - potentially his marriage and his home. This isn't some glory, reach for the gold crap. This is real life America, today. He fails and he's very likely screwed for a long, long time.

This particular guy, yeah, he sounds like me and maybe he gets a little luck and makes it. I was wrong in this instance and I wish him well. But Jones (not alone, the industry does this as a whole) winds up being a hypocrite to the nth degree. This job IS an investment, it's huge, and it's rare someone takes the true care to divest the risks involved.

That's my take and I'm sticking to it. I can tell you, I'll never recommend another new person to this job. I think B24 has it right in this instance.

Everyone from Jones thinks the only other alternative to this job is digging ditches or being a cashier at an outlet mall.

Have a B.S. in Finance? Fully licensed? 2-3 years experience in the trenches? Go dig ditches it's your only other option.

damn...this guy makes $65k at best buy selling lcd's and plasmas???? wtf am i doing this for?

[quote=jgleeson]

Hi Justin,

I saw your thread about starting out in the business. You might want to have a look at this Registered Rep. piece we ran about the experiences of folks who went down that road, called "Rookie Survivors:"

http://registeredrep.com/advisorland/career/finance_rookie_survivors/index.html

Good luck with your decision,

Jerry Gleeson

Senior Editor

Registered Rep.

[/quote]

That piece is the worst reporting ever..

You took an example of a guy who took over a EDJ office and got $20MM in assets..

The other guy works at an office where his brother has been for 12 years.

That is the worst fluff piece every..

[quote=justincredible]

Jumpman, yes I want to be a financial advisor and I don't have a real emergency fund....yet.   Actually, I had about $15k but wiped it out to pay off the wedding.  I am currently rebuilding my emergency fund. 

Spiff, I agree that it would be very difficult to finish my degree while trying to grow my business with Jones.  Ultimately I would far too often have to pick between school and work.  I fear that will set me up for failure so I agree that I should finish up my degree before taking a job with EDJ. 

I have a couple of other random questions for the board.  What do you use as a contact list when cold calling with Edward Jones?  Do you only call people that you have met door-to-door?  Do you only call businesses?  Are you provided with or do you purchase any lists?  The main reason I ask is because if you were to simply pick up the phone book and start dialing how do you know that you aren't calling somebody that is on a 'do not call' list?  I was just curious as to how you get around that. 

Also, I have heard that EDJ only matches $500 a year to your 401k.  Is it really that low?  Do they offer employees any additional alternatives for their own retirement planning?  Just curious as to if you think there is a benefit working for Edward Jones for retirement investing beyond what is offered to our clients. 

I am currently reading "The New Financial Advisor" by Tim Murray WTF?? TIM... you read like a 1st grader..NICK MURRAY... pay better attention..and I love it so far!  Any additional book or website recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

[/quote]

Whenever a future jones recruit comes on here I get embarassed that I ever worked at EDJ... They hire anyone now.. barely of step above PFS..

[quote=squash2]

[quote=jgleeson]

Hi Justin,

I saw your thread about starting out in the business. You might want to have a look at this Registered Rep. piece we ran about the experiences of folks who went down that road, called "Rookie Survivors:"

http://registeredrep.com/advisorland/career/finance_rookie_survivors/index.html

Good luck with your decision,

Jerry Gleeson

Senior Editor

Registered Rep.

[/quote]

That piece is the worst reporting ever..

You took an example of a guy who took over a EDJ office and got $20MM in assets..

The other guy works at an office where his brother has been for 12 years.

That is the worst fluff piece every..

[/quote]

It is horrible.

"Gerstenschlager says his military background certainly helps open doors in this part of the country, but he attributes much of his success to an unrelenting work ethic: His only regret during the market's worst days from November through March — not working more Saturdays."

$40mm AUM in 2 years. The most ironic part is: "...more than ever people are looking for someone to be straight with them." Like not disclosing how the AUM was handed to you.

Makes my head hurt

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

[quote=LockEDJ]

ROTFLMAO ... yeah, he'll be leaving a lot of dollars on the table over the course of his career, if he's a one in a hundred sort of guy. Sort of limits the exposure to the fact that he's probably risking $100,000 in lost income between now and the next three years in order to make that pie-in-the-sky income, doesn't it?

It's amazing to me that Jones can do this with a straight face. The obfuscation of the truth belies what I believe is a good organization. Look, Mr. ATT might make that coin. Might, might might. But as a conservative Edward Jones broker, would you EVER recommend a product that would definitely LOSE $100,000 over the next three years on the POSSIBILITY - a 1-in-a-100 shot - of making signficant coin down the line?

Sort of makes you a hypocrite, doesn't it????

[/quote]

What are you talking about?  How do you figure that he's going to lose $100K over the next three years?  I'm not following that line of your thinking. 

How is it that Jones is obfuscating the truth?  Those were numbers I pulled out of the air.  Jones will be much more conservative with what they tell him.  I do know of a few guys who have hit $200K in 5-6 years.  Are they rare?  Absolutely.  His question was about 401K match.  So, his choices are to stay where he's at bringing home $2500 a month (not sure if that's accurate or not) or he can take a chance and possibly end up making a bunch more.  My guess is that he's making $40K-ish at his big box store.  The Jones average in their recruiting info say if you're at 100% of standard through year 3 your compensation is $53,840, $58,500, and then $84,000Those numbers are BS and you know it.. The account bonuses alone are luck of the draw.. I think it goes more like $40k, 50k, 65k.  My guess is that he can come close to doubling his paycheck in the next three years if he's got any sort of ability at all.  Where is it again that Jones is obfuscating the truth and that he'll be losing $100K?  

And yes, if I had a client who had money to invest, but would lose a little on the front end to make a bunch on the back end, I'd take that bet all day long. 

[/quote]

And every Jones guy bucked hay for 2 cents per bale...

I nominate this thread for the lobby... oh wait wrong forum.

GHGR - I don't know that I've heard many people from Jones voice the opinion that the only other jobs besides Jones are min wage ditch digging type jobs.  There are tons of ways to make $65K in this world, being an FA for Jones is only one of them. 

Lock -  I don't really care for the health care benefits at Jones.  I think they're expensive.  However, I hear my clients talking about the health care they pay for out of pocket and I realize that ours aren't horrible.  My benefits cost for my family runs $440 a month for medical, $80 for dental, and $15 for vision.  I also contribute to my HSA. 

His benefits as a new FA, not that it matters because his wife works, would be subsidized at around 60%.  So, if he took the Jones benefits and his family was exactly the same size as mine it would cost him around $220 a month.  

I have no idea how that compares to another brokerage firm, or another company for that matter, but I don't believe it's way out of line.     

Taking a job like the one we have is absolutely a risk.  He can sit in his big box store selling TVs and continue to make $65K.  The risk is that he gets downsized, fired, etc.  Trouble is, he doesn't have any control over his fate there. 

Or, he could take the risk that he could flame out at EDJ and give it a shot.  If he's an intelligent guy with a decent work ethic and is even a mediocre salesman, he should be fine.  He may not be the next Van Pearcy or Troy Nelson, but he can easily make more than he does now and at least have some control over his future.  I think it's a risk worth taking. 

[quote=justincredible]

I actually make roughly $60-$65k a year at the big box.  So basically right in the middle of both of your estimates.  Health plan is not an issue since my wife has amazing coverage for both of us.  Really all I am losing in the 401k match is about $2k a year.  Once again, that isn't a good thing but it isn't a deal breaker. 

Lock, I think you were so ready to pounce on EDJ's benefits that you didn't fully read my scenerio.  I do appreciate both sides of the argument so don't get me wrong.  Will I be leaving some money on the table in the short-term?  No doubt.  For me it is worth it because I WANT TO BE A FINANCIAL ADVISOR.  I don't want to be in retail with crappy hours and always working weekends and holidays.  I would LOVE to put in long hours when the quality and amount of my work is reflected in compensation.  In the FA world, working long hours and weekends is to YOUR benefit.  In retail, working long hours and weekends gets you nothing additional in return (I'm on salary).  Also, I have zero passion for what I currently do.  I just happened to start as a seasonal employee 4 years back and quickly worked my way up by taking pride in my work.  Lately I've done a lot of thinking about what I want to do for a living because I have always viewed my current job as a stop-gap.  I always thought I'd just come up with a great idea some day and start my own business.  Recently it has become very clear to me that I have passion for two primary things:  Sports and Personal Finance. 

The bottom line is, even if being a financial advisor only paid $65k a year I would still want to do it.  Granted, I've never actually been a FA before so it may be hard to believe that I know this is what I want to do with my life.  I know that I am INCREDIBLY interested and am taking the steps to make it become a reality.  Maybe some don't think Jones is the right route, but everything I've heard seems to be that it is a great place to start....at the very least.

[/quote]

Just don't go to Jones...Instead consider Wells Fargo Advisors and get a 6% dollar for dollar match on 401k plus you will be in a much better firm.  Also, you won't have to pay for the toilet paper for your office....Also, the health insurance is less than half of what spiff said he pays.  I think I only pay about 160 per month for my family plan. Dental is like 25/vision is like 6.

Once again...I could care less about health insurance.  My wife has coverage that is golden. 

Also, sorry that I had the author wrong on the book I'm reading.  I've been reading it for a few days now and I'm still on the cover.  After a week or so I'll make it past the title and to the author.  Hopefully I can get to chapter one by the end of the calendar year. 

You guys finally guessed my company right, but I'm salaried so I don't sell TVs (anymore).  I am an Operations Manager. 

I'm also in contact with a guy that would love to recruit me under Exemplar Financial Network but I know nothing about them.  He said that I would definitely need to finish my degree and have a hefty savings account because there would be no base salary to start.  He also said the training isn't the greatest because they typically take on folks that have experience being an advisor.  I know him personally so he isn't just some random guy trying to recruit me so he sees some of the benefits of me going to Jones. 

I am going to finish out my degree and continue to meet as many people as possible that are in the profession.  Hopefully by the time I graduate I will have a hefty emergency fund and multiple options.  Since I can't prospect clients yet I might as well prospect firms and get to know as many advisors in the area as I can. 

Based on everything I've read and have heard I believe the average salary ranges that Jones gives are a bit inflated.  I mean if only 20% of people 'make it' then how can the average person be making close to $60k in each of their first two years.  There has to be enough people making $30k or less that end up failing that would bring that number down.  Lock, I think you are on to something that there must be some sort of qualifier for that number. 

However, I don't think many people can argue that Jones isn't a good place to start.  Even from Jones bashers, I've heard good things about their training program and that it is a good place to learn the ropes.  Now I do know two people personally that work for EDJ and they seem to really like it.  So while it isn't for everyone, it sure seems to work for some.  Hell, some people would kill for my current job but it isn't for me. 

I just want to get in the industry.  Whether Jones is the right answer is up for debate.  Right now I just don't have a lot of options.  Maybe more will come as I continue to get out there and meet people.

I Am Legend, its not like I have an offer from Wells Fargo and Jones that I am weighing.  Given my current resume with no advisor experience and no banking experience I don't see any chance in hell that Wells Fargo is going to give me the time of day.  From what I understand Financial Advisor positions within banking institutions are highly competitive and you have to either have shown the ability to build a successful book of business or have had 'paid your dues' working as a teller for a decade. 

If I had an 'in' at Wells Fargo or thought I had a snowballs chance then I would be asking about them.  I'm not saying that Wells Fargo is better or worse than Jones because it probably depends on the individual.  They just aren't on my radar screen right now.  Or more accurately, I'm not on their radar screen. 

I am not talking about the bank side, but PCG which is the former AG Edwards and Wachovia Securities part, but you would def need to finish your degree first.

These forums are amazing I wish I would have found them before joining EJ, because chances are I probably wouldn't have joined EJ.  Don't get me wrong I think EJ is one of the best places to start if you have no sales experience or don't have any financial background.  However with that said like you I did save before I made the decision to join and had $12K in the bank.  If you feel that is adequate fine pull the trigger don't rely on everyone else’s opinion just make the decision and go for it.  The problem I had was the not while producing but during the Study For Success ($8 per hour are you freakn kidding me), but I survived.  I survived primarily because I busted my ass and focused on finding assets the accounts came with it.  In addition to the assets and accounts so did the bonuses (we just banked them to build our emergency fund bigger). 

Don't get to excited about several FA's encouraging you to join because you have to realize they receive diversification credit for new hires so buyer beware.  I would also caution you if you join EJ by being very patient and wait for a Goodknight or/an office to open up.  I was too impatient and pushed the issue as a New/New and opened a new office, shortly after construction began a $15mm office opened up in a better market & I had to pass it up.  In my opinion you have to believe in yourself and not rely too heavily on others for their opinion, this job isn't hard it just takes a while that's why so many have recommended you having a nice reserve.  Good luck and have fun door knocking.

HA  39-40% payout?  good luck pal... if you do any equity business or the occassional b-share there's no way you will see 39%....more like 38.6 or so a month... if you use their insurance GROUP plan, add dental, maybe eye care and HSA, life insurance and disability... wow there goes 800 -1000 a month off the top... then add 401k and taxes... long distance (because not all clients life withing 5 miles of you) and any office expenses through paybills.....you'll be lucky to take home 25 cents on the dollar of your GROSS production....  so gross $25, 000 and see maybe $6000 for yourself...   Edward Jones is like a Vegas Casino, they don't exist because the people win!