UBS to Sell Small Branches?

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Sherman McCoy's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-30

Persistent rumor has it UBS is to announce the sale of branches that produce less than $10MM gross rev on Monday 03/23/09.  Details anyone?

Don Draper's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-27

to whom?

Sherman McCoy's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-30

Possibly to Stifel Nicolaus.

cobra's picture
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I heard that too.  I wonder what, if any, retention packagage the FAs will get.  I can't imagine it would be much of anything.  50% or less?

leftml's picture
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Joined: 2008-11-13

I believe the brance needs 10 million in revenue to keep a producing manager.  Offices will not be sold but will not have a stand alone manager

NOVA's picture
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That's a very different rumor.  I never thought UBS was a fan of the producing BOM model before all the other stuff started anyway.  If they have less then $10 mil, perhaps management would be redirected to the nearest larger office?  Is that the implication? (or just my inference?)

nestegg's picture
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That will be great for you guys in smaller branches if the rumor to SF is true!

HymanRoth's picture
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cobra wrote:I heard that too.  I wonder what, if any, retention packagage the FAs will get.  I can't imagine it would be much of anything.  50% or less?It's pathetic watching you wirehouse guys walk around with your hands out all the time....I mean really....   "Can I just have a bit more sir?"

Lew Ashby's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-13

WTF?  Are you guys for real?  Why in the world would they do that?  And why is $10MM the bogey?  Our branch does less than $10MM, but there's no way we're being sold.
 
Who starts these rumors anyway? 

cobra's picture
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Joined: 2006-11-22

Get used to it.  You're being sold.  You have no choice in the matter.  You will take what you get and be happy with it. 

bondo's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-15

So, are they being sold or will just have no manager?  What percentage of the UBS offices do less than $10mm?

cppr33's picture
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It looks like something is definately going on here. My manager just called me to let me know he got word yesterday AM that he had to be on a flight later tonight to a meeting.

He called around to others and there is some going on with Stifel, no sure what but like he said, they are not going to get us all on flights at the last minute for nothing.
 
I was told that offices under $10mm make up nearly 60% of UBS revenue in USA.

mnbondguy's picture
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Joined: 2008-05-13

cppr33 wrote:It looks like something is definately going on here. My manager just called me to let me know he got word yesterday AM that he had to be on a flight later tonight to a meeting.

He called around to others and there is some going on with Stifel, no sure what but like he said, they are not going to get us all on flights at the last minute for nothing.
 
I was told that offices under $10mm make up nearly 60% of UBS revenue in USA.
I wonder how many of those offices are legacy Piper Jaffrey offices?  If so, they could be a good fit for Stifel.

cppr33's picture
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I don't know. The only thing I know of Stifel is what I have seen here.
 

nestegg's picture
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cppr33 wrote:I don't know. The only thing I know of Stifel is what I have seen here.
 Are you at UBS now?One thing I will say...when I joined SF in Jan when you log into the computer system as it would load it had a line that said 3500 clients meaning I guess 3500 brokers on the system? A fw weeks ago they did an update and now it shows that 5000 can be on the system. I assumed this was because of the influx of teh Butler Wick Brokers as well as the mass that was coming from AGE/Wachovia...but maybe there is more to it.....

cobra's picture
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Joined: 2006-11-22

As good as Stifel was,  I sincerely doubt they have the infrastructure and human resources to execute this rapid growth spree they have been on.  They may pull it off, but their culture will change and guess what...probably selling out to a wirehouse down the road.
 
I like Hilliard Lyons.  They know how big they can be and still maintain their culture and have the discipline to execute it.  IMHO, Hilliard is the next Stifel. 
 
I know if our office is going to be sold to Stifel,  all of the FAs will go to Hilliard instead, if they will have us.

nestegg's picture
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cobra wrote:As good as Stifel was,  I sincerely doubt they have the infrastructure and human resources to execute this rapid growth spree they have been on.  They may pull it off, but their culture will change and guess what...probably selling out to a wirehouse down the road.
 
I like Hilliard Lyons.  They know how big they can be and still maintain their culture and have the discipline to execute it.  IMHO, Hilliard is the next Stifel. 
 
I know if our office is going to be sold to Stifel,  all of the FAs will go to Hilliard instead, if they will have us.Good luck whatever ends up happening....you are at a wirehouse now, so why would you leave SF if aquired? You will be going to a much better culture than a wirehouse.AGE had a great culture and we had almost 700 offices and 7000 brokers so it can be done.

cppr33's picture
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Joined: 2007-08-06

Yes I am with UBS now.  I am in their NFA program for newbies. I am a year into production so I am sure any retention paid would exclude someone like me.
I think I am going to look around.

nestegg's picture
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cppr33 wrote:Yes I am with UBS now.  I am in their NFA program for newbies. I am a year into production so I am sure any retention paid would exclude someone like me.
I think I am going to look around. Always good to keep your options open, you never know, Wachovia gave AGE trainees a retetntion so anything is possible.

cppr33's picture
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Anyone know about the Stifel platform for institutions?
What kind of retention did Wachovia pay to AGE for trainees?

nestegg's picture
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cppr33 wrote:Anyone know about the Stifel platform for institutions?
More info....what do you mean?

cppr33's picture
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I am sure they an open platform for managed money which can be used to serve foundations, colleges, etc with an endowment.
I am curious as to their 401k capabilities. I have been prospecting former clients of mine from my past career for their 401k and I have just taken broker of record with a change over to a different provider either coming 7/1/09 or 1/1/2010 depending on the client.

nestegg's picture
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cppr33 wrote:I am sure they an open platform for managed money which can be used to serve foundations, colleges, etc with an endowment.
I am curious as to their 401k capabilities. I have been prospecting former clients of mine from my past career for their 401k and I have just taken broker of record with a change over to a different provider either coming 7/1/09 or 1/1/2010 depending on the client. Oh I gotcha, yes you can do all of that here, open platform no proprietary products

cppr33's picture
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Nest or others - Anything else you can tell me about Stifel?
 
I would like to be ready for the questions once something is announced.

nestegg's picture
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cppr33 wrote:Nest or others - Anything else you can tell me about Stifel?
 
I would like to be ready for the questions once something is announced.
I have been thee 2 months after a decade at AGE...I love it, hands off, great back office, great research dept, no haircuts, high payouts...no real negatives for me at this point.

NFA1972's picture
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Joined: 2008-08-11

I'm currently at UBS. My BOM did also leave kind of mysteriously on Thursday after work, and won't be back until Monday.
 
Things that make you go "WTF!?!"
 
I'm actually leaving to go to another B/D in April. If Stifel is the buyer, I may have to stick around.
 
 

cobra's picture
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Joined: 2006-11-22

Our manager did the same thing.  We talked to SF two months ago then they stopped all discussion with UBS people.  What they offered us then was less than 1/2 of what Hilliard offered .  So if SF is the buyer, they sure aren't going to offer us any more than the original offer.  It's our concensus they were good, but growing too fast and trnasition will be a nightmare.  Right or wrong out crew is going to Hilliard.  Anything is better than UBS!

Lew Ashby's picture
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cobra wrote:Our manager did the same thing.  We talked to SF two months ago then they stopped all discussion with UBS people.  What they offered us then was less than 1/2 of what Hilliard offered .  So if SF is the buyer, they sure aren't going to offer us any more than the original offer.  It's our concensus they were good, but growing too fast and trnasition will be a nightmare.  Right or wrong out crew is going to Hilliard.  Anything is better than UBS!
 
Wow, anything is better than UBS?  Come on, now.  You ever worked at Jones?  I mean, really.  What's so bad about UBS?  I've doubled by business since coming to UBS 3 years ago from Jones-- even in the face of this market and the economic debacle.
 
UBS is no where near perfect, trust me, but to say anything is better....how about ML or Wach?  Those folks have it bad right now, not UBS folks.
 
Regardless, good luck with your move.  No matter how much prep you do, it's a royal pain in the arse.  I hope you're able to take all the clients you want.
 
LA

NOVA's picture
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Joined: 2005-01-11

OK.  It's Monday morning.  If the rumor was true wouldn't we know by now?

cppr33's picture
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Joined: 2007-08-06

Meeting did not start yet.
 
First break is 1130 Chicago time.

Iocaine's picture
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Joined: 2007-06-25

So those of you who had managers mysteriously vacate, are you 10mm+ revenue offices or are you in lower production offices?

nestegg's picture
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Joined: 2007-06-14

Its past 11 30...so whats the news...

Iocaine's picture
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nestegg's picture
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Welcome guys, glad to have you!!!

burtonfinancial1's picture
Joined: 2008-09-30

Anybody know where these UBS branches are at specifically? This is WILD!  Am I nuts or is there a bit of a culture divide between SF and UBS???

Krapinsky's picture
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Joined: 2006-09-07

Well, we have been sold to Stifel Nicholas.  This explains why they stopped talking to us individually 3 months ago.  Back then they offered us a reasonable deal, but now they have us over a barrel and I'm guessing we will get nothing as far a retention deal and like it.  Let's face it, we were the "crumbs" of UBS.  From what I hear all the other regionals have stopped recruiting indefinitely.  I'm sure SF is a good firm and we will learn to like it.  The climate has changed so much in just the last three months.

NFA1972's picture
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Joined: 2008-08-11

I'm sure it's mostly small suburban branches. Not major markets.

mnbondguy's picture
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burtonfinancial1 wrote:Anybody know where these UBS branches are at specifically? This is WILD!  Am I nuts or is there a bit of a culture divide between SF and UBS???
 
I will bet they are in the midwest - pacific northwest. I bet a lot of them are legacy piper jaffrey branches in smaller markets that didn't really fit the UBS model anyway.  SF has been trying to expand west of the mississippi, this deal makes sense for both firms, and thier brokers. 

burtonfinancial1's picture
Joined: 2008-09-30

Rationale...1) Clean up, sell small underperforming offices2) SELL the leaner better producing US unit14% of it was sold to Stifel!

WSxAG's picture
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cobra's picture
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Does anybody know if SF is offering a retention pacakage when they buy a branch?

Sherman McCoy's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-30

Rumors come home to roost, for good and/or bad.  SF deal is less than wonderful; However, unemployment is less desireable.  Time will tell whether their deal is worth accepting.

cobra's picture
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My God, Sherman McCoy!  Where have you been?  Good to hear from you!  Still drinking as much as you used to?

nestegg's picture
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Joined: 2007-06-14

I beleive there will be retention...look at the slideshow posted, and I also listened to the SF call, sounds like retention is part of the deal.Welcome to the family guys!

Sherman McCoy's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-30

I was just marinating some ice cubes with some Friends of Fermentation.  Isn't that what is done at UBS?  No offense to Art Cashin, who's the best I've known at UBS!

cppr33's picture
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Sherman McCoy wrote:I was just marinating some ice cubes with some Friends of Fermentation.  Isn't that what is done at UBS?  No offense to Art Cashin, who's the best I've known at UBS!
 
Art is fantastic. I had the chance to meet him at an event in Philly a few weeks ago, what a fantastic guy. I got there early and decided I might as well have a drink at the bar, I look over and there he was. I went over to introduce myself and struck up a great conversation. I will be missing his comments as my branch was dumped.
 
As far as retention, I do not know numbers but I believe there will be. We had an improvised conference call with our manager who was at the meeting in Chicago. He said that he had the parameters for retention. We were told that all contracts will be honored which was my concern as I am in the NFA.
 
I want to see more about Stifel and their capabilties before I say if this is a good deal or not. Yes there is a better payout and supposedly no more nickle and diming clients which I like.

cppr33's picture
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Any others from UBS included in this sale?
What has been the reaction? Your thoughts?

Sportsfreakbob's picture
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oh good - now we can start another 400 page thread on whether or not their will be retention. Just like the Wachovia thread.If there is retention, i doubt it will be a big number. Stifel doesnt pay what the wires do for recruits. And look at what SB and BAC/ML paid in retention for a 500k producer.This new event reinforces my opinion that independent is the only way to have any control of your own destiny. And that the wires are all going for BIG. They dont want small offices and they dont want small producers.

nestegg's picture
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Joined: 2007-06-14

If you guys read the powerpoint, money is set aside for retention...will it be huge...no Stifel doesn't pay the most $$ on the street for recruits nor will they for retention... but I would expect everyone to get something...SF loves the 200-500 a year guy...they are profitable for us, where the wire's can't make it work.

NFA1972's picture
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Joined: 2008-08-11

My Branch is affected. Major headcount reduction prior to sale. 3 CSAs and all NFADs gone by end of week. I'm handing in my resignation tomorrow.

nestegg's picture
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NFA1972 wrote:My Branch is affected. Major headcount reduction prior to sale. 3 CSAs and all NFADs gone by end of week. I'm handing in my resignation tomorrow.Seriously?Wow you guys are crazy...

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