Cutting 4th and 5th quintiles (ex-trainee/newb)

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C_FA's picture
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Joined: 2008-12-07

If a firm cuts trainees of any quintile and salaried FAAs, that's one thing. In the past, have firms cut 4th and 5th quintiles in branch who were earning their own money (meaning, off salary), perhaps dependent on LOS?  (i.e. >10y LOS with under 500M in production)   Thanks. 

ABOM's picture
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Joined: 2008-11-01

if thats supposed to be a question vs. a thought than the answer is yes.

C_FA's picture
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Joined: 2008-12-07

How has this been historically done? 
I'm not in the area where I'm under any sort of gun, I'm just curious...I am thinking it will happen at my firm (SB) before too long--first cut all the trainees, then newbies, and then start moving up through the quintiles. 

OldAndTired's picture
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Joined: 2009-03-17

Q4 and 5 are never safe, except in late 90's. Today if you are a Q5 you are all but gone. Q4 is holding the door for you and will meet you at the local pub.

OS's picture
OS
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Joined: 2008-11-03

What about newbies in first year in 2nd or 3rd quintile?

ABOM's picture
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Joined: 2008-11-01

the 4s and 5s will be let go very soon (as soon as they hit 6 to 12 mos)

then YOU become a 4th 5th quintile. your safest course of action to survive this bear market if your a new Fa is get on a team or bring in constant net new money (500k a month)

S&P low 666's picture
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Joined: 2009-04-08

yep

burtonfinancial1's picture
Joined: 2008-09-30

Great article today in Forbes... speaking exactly to what happens when you keep cutting the 4th and 5th quintile and don't train and develop the futureRecruitingHelp Wanted: Advisors Under 50Joshua Lipton, 04.20.09,
6:30 PM ETAs
wave after wave of layoffs hit the financial firms, there is one
financial job that just can't attract enough applicants to fill the
openings: financial adviser or broker. According to industry insiders
and consultants, nobody wants to be a stockbroker these days. According
to Cerulli Associates, nearly half of all financial advisers today are
over 50 years old. And that aging talent pool isn't being replenished
with young blood: Less than 5%, or just 15,000, of the 298,000 U.S.
advisers are currently 30 years old or younger, according to Cerulli
Associates.
"Long term, this will definitely kill us," says Fusion Advisor
Network's Philip Palaveev of the dearth of young-blood flowing into the
business. "When this wave of advisers over 50 years old tries to
retire, how will we absorb the clients that they leave behind."
All this seems counterintuitive given that there has never been a
more pressing need for financial advice. More than 70 million baby
boomers are in "pre-retirement" according to T. Rowe Price, and given
the recent bear market, many simply don't have enough saved to carry
them through the golden years.
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Why aren't young people being attracted to financial advice?
Scott Smith, a senior analyst at Cerulli, attributes the shortage of
young advisers to several factors. For one, there continues to be a
general lack of awareness about the business, Smith says. A lot of high
school and college students aren't aware of what financial advisers do,
exactly, or even that the profession exists.
There's also a reputational problem, made worse by the recent financial crisis. Given that financial firms like Merrill Lynch, Citigroup, AIG
and other "Wall Street" firms are being blamed for current financial
woes and laying off people in droves, the prospect of starting a career
as a "broker"or "financial adviser" holds little interest for most
young people.
Moreover, many are turned off by the prospect of cold-calling and
selling for a living. Still a bigger reason is the shrinking number of
training programs.
"The training programs are no longer around," says Howard Diamond,
managing director of executive search firm Diamond Consultants. Indeed
Merrill lynch slashed its financial consultant training program in
January. Morgan Stanley and UBS have largely done away with their broker training programs as well.
Schwab, which caters to independent advisory firms as a custodian,
actively supports advisers once in the business and when they
transition from wirehouse to independent advisory. Unfortunately, it
does little to bring new blood into financial adviser ranks.
Luckily, some universities have been stepping in to fill the void.
There are now about 100 university financial planning programs across
the country, including at schools like Kansas State University,
Virginia Tech and Texas Tech, where students take classes on retirement
planning, risk management, estate planning, tax law and the latest
planning technology.
The students graduate prepared to take their certified financial
planner exams. Starting salaries are usually between $50,000 and
$60,000.
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What can young financial advisers expect once they get certified and land at an advisory firm?
Jon Yankee is co-founder of Reston, Va.-based Fox, Joss &
Yankee, a financial planning firm with $200 million in assets under
management. Yankee's firm has hired two young advisers, both of whom
had completed M.B.A.s and their Certificates of Financial Planning
designations. These associates, both still in their 20s, now help
prepare for client meetings, providing support to more senior members
of the small firm.
"We involve our associates in everything we do," says Yankee. "Many
of the clients now call associates with basic service issues. The
partners then don't have to spend time on paperwork. Instead, we can
spend time speaking to clients and addressing the issues that concern
them."
There are currently about 175 undergraduates enrolled in Texas
Tech's financial planning program, says associate professor Deena Katz.
Typically, she says, students find work right away. But today. she says
the school is having a tougher time placing its graduates in jobs
because of industry cutbacks. But the need for these young advisers is
greater than ever, she says. The profession needs to attract new talent
if it's going to meet and satisfy the growing demand for financial
advisers.
"We don't have enough financial planners to handle all the baby
boomers," Katz says. "They will all need advice. They can't do it on
their own. It is way too complicated, and they have now been way too
devastated. They aren't prepared for retirement. So this is a huge
opportunity for kids. It's one of the best-kept secrets."

Bodysurf's picture
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Joined: 2008-08-02

If only the most challenging aspect of this business were the financial planning aspect.  It isn't.  It's finding and landing new prospects and accounts.It's easier to train a good salesperson how to be an FA, than the other way around. 

burtonfinancial1's picture
Joined: 2008-09-30

I understand cutting FAs who fall back or drop down into lower quintiles. What makes no sense, especially given the gray hair problem in the business is cutting training programs and FAs just graduating like has been the case at ML and UBS recently. Morgan did this a few years back and the result was record deals being paid to lure in bigger producers. Musical chairs vs. growing your own so to speak. 

Conrad Dobler's picture
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Joined: 2009-01-11

burtonfinancial1 wrote:Morgan did this a few years back and the result was record deals being paid to lure in bigger producers.  
 
Writing big checks to bring in big producers wasn't the "result" of cutting trainees. The only connection between writing those checks and firing trainees is that both efforts raised the average production per FA at the firm. That's the key metric of a brokerage firm these days. The fact is no one's found a magic formula that increases the survival and success rates of trainees to a significant level. It's still "throw a bunch against the wall and see which ones stick". Where as writing checks to recruit successful FAs is a high probablity route to increasing average production.

Squash1's picture
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Joined: 2008-11-19

I think this industry will have a serious shortfall in about 3-5 years.

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