The Cult

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mrjones147's picture
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Joined: 2008-09-24

Who saw the big Jim's uptick live talking about the cult being in good order?

glass man's picture
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Joined: 2008-09-23

I should have watched it but I didn't.  I'm a five year guy still trying to get the branch over the top. 
 
Do yourself a favor.  Get ahead of the curve and have at least 30 to 35 million by year 5.  I've only got 23 million and it's a b*tch trying to hit 18K every month.
 
One paradox in this business.  If you're going to go down it's better to go down early (so you can get on with your life) rather than burn up five years of prime time career time.
 
I haven't thrown in the towel yet.  I still like Jones.  It's lost a bit of the luster though.  They've got many of the same flaws as the other firms.  The trainings top notch.  The people overall are friendly.  The nepotism and favoritism are the same though.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

glass - ice has the right idea if Jones puts you on goals and says to hand over the keys.  If I went anywhere it would be indy.  And I'd probably be happy to pay for my own biz cards.  My mentor has about $60mm AUM and he just went red over the summer.  So, evidently you can have triple the assets you have and still find it difficult to hit $18K/month.
Mr. Jones - I didn't see it, but I've read enough stuff from Jim to understand that we have a lot of working capital out there to fall back on.  It doesn't suprise me though that he would get on the TV and talk about it with us. 

B24's picture
B24
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Joined: 2008-07-08

mrjones147 wrote:Who saw the big Jim's uptick live talking about the cult being in good order?
 
Let me ask you something....what SHOULD he have done?  Seriously.  What's your beef with what he talked about?  He simply said "this is the business we're in, these are the reasons we are OK."

Borker Boy's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-09

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
glass - ice has the right idea if Jones puts you on goals and says to hand over the keys.  If I went anywhere it would be indy.  And I'd probably be happy to pay for my own biz cards.  My mentor has about $60mm AUM and he just went red over the summer.  So, evidently you can have triple the assets you have and still find it difficult to hit $18K/month.
Mr. Jones - I didn't see it, but I've read enough stuff from Jim to understand that we have a lot of working capital out there to fall back on.  It doesn't suprise me though that he would get on the TV and talk about it with us. 
 
How long's your mentor been out?
 
This is one of the scariest aspects of this business: the idea that you can be out for five years and still struggle to hit $18K each month, or that you can have $60 million AUM and still not meet minimum expectations.
 
 

norway401's picture
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Joined: 2007-10-16

Wow 60million and still not meet minimum. Spiff... Money Market Account or TBills? That appears to be a real problem.

bspears's picture
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Joined: 2006-11-08

OR...the guy or gal is looking to jump.

Spaceman Spiff's picture
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Joined: 2006-08-08

He's been out over 10 years.  Family situation has been rough recently.  So, he's admittedly slacked off for the last 6 months or so.  And to spears comment, that thought did cross my mind.  I know he's not opposed to it, but he's also not the type who I think would want to make the jump.  He's just too entrenched in the way he does biz now to make a change.  We'll see. 
 
It is a scary part of this biz when you are a commission only advisor and your focus gets sidetracked.  If you aren't making the phone calls, you aren't placing trades.   
 
I told him to focus on moving all of his assets to Advisory Solutions or MAP and he can work as little as he wants to!

Borker Boy's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-09

Spaceman Spiff wrote:He's been out over 10 years.  Family situation has been rough recently.  So, he's admittedly slacked off for the last 6 months or so.  And to spears comment, that thought did cross my mind.  I know he's not opposed to it, but he's also not the type who I think would want to make the jump.  He's just too entrenched in the way he does biz now to make a change.  We'll see. 
 
It is a scary part of this biz when you are a commission only advisor and your focus gets sidetracked.  If you aren't making the phone calls, you aren't placing trades.   
 
I told him to focus on moving all of his assets to Advisory Solutions or MAP and he can work as little as he wants to!
 
I agree. To heck with chasing new money. I'm about taking care of #1 baby!
 
Advisory Soultions, here I come...

norway401's picture
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Joined: 2007-10-16

Ditto Borker

GoldCaddy's picture
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Joined: 2007-02-16

I had about $15mm AUM when I left Jones.  I have about the same amount now and have a trailing 12 GDC >$200k.  Staying at Jones is the classic description of insanity.

2legit2quit's picture
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Joined: 2008-06-22

Ive got $31 Million AUM - trying to move to fee based. Got just under $3MM in MAP and 2MM in Advisory Solutions.  So far with that and service fees. I can turn on the lights and be at 10k gross.   Is he not working at 60MM at all?  that seems pretty far fetched over a 4 month rolling average. No new clients? 

B24's picture
B24
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Joined: 2008-07-08

There are some advisors out there that built their businesses on stocks and bonds. So if you think about it, imagine 60mm AUM, where 60-70% is stocks and bonds. If you aren't working, you aren't making much. And if you've been in th business a while, and are complacent you probably don't have a lot of "automatic" stuff (DCA business, SIMPLE's, 401K's, etc.). I know a guy, he's about 10 years in (he's in his late 50's), inherited probably half his book from failed trainees and offices over the years, has about 65mm AUM, he struggles to do 15 gross a month sometimes. I know of a few indies that do in the 10K gross range per month (working out of their houses). Not a bad gig for a few hours a day and no overhead.

fastcar's picture
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Joined: 2007-02-20

2legit2quit wrote:Ive got $31 Million AUM - trying to move to fee based. Got just under $3MM in MAP and 2MM in Advisory Solutions.  So far with that and service fees. I can turn on the lights and be at 10k gross.   Is he not working at 60MM at all?  that seems pretty far fetched over a 4 month rolling average. No new clients? 
 
 
no its not....he's looking to bail.

Gaddock's picture
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Joined: 2007-02-23

If you have 60 million and cant get 18k out of it? What the heck is it in CDs?
 
You all need to learn how to use options. Cash cow great hedge and income for the client. I get 6% in and out with no complaints about fees.

Borker Boy's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-09

Gaddock wrote:If you have 60 million and cant get 18k out of it? What the heck is it in CDs?
 
You all need to learn how to use options. Cash cow great hedge and income for the client. I get 6% in and out with no complaints about fees.
 
Jim won't let us.

glass man's picture
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Joined: 2008-09-23

Hey Guys,
 
Great thread.  The honest bantering back and forth does a lot to alleviate my mood.
 
Being mostly transactional has definitely come back to bite me in the arse.  Jones only recently has come out with decent fee based offerings so being transactional wasn't only my own doing.
 
I feel like I'm a pretty decent bear market broker but the last two weeks has been difficult.  the news has been particularly catastrophic which puts even the good leads on slow motion.
 
I made a decision today to get back to using my gate keeper.  In a "crisis" I start fielding calls as they come in which kills my proactive work - which kills my business.
 
I've vented a bit on these forums but really I don't hold any grudge against asset inheritors.  I just realize they have a different job from me.  I don't accept lectures from asset inheritors though.  I'm ready to put the gloves on and step into the ring with some of these asset inheritors.  I'd honestly love that challenge.  One ring, two sets of gloves, and an even playing field. 
 
I must be a glutton for punishment because sometimes just finding other work seems like the "solution".  This year has been like a never ending marathon.  I've had a number of uncanny experiences at Jones.
 
Uncanny experience one - I was getting to the point where 15k was easy and I was in my first month where 15k was my quota.  That same month they announced they were raising it.  I understand they got to raise it but raising it the exact same month where I finally got my chin over the bar - even the most dyed in the wool company man has to say that's crappy timing.
 
Having good numbers and being in a region where 150 million got handed out and getting goose egged was uncanny experience number 2.  It's far better to be a rookie surrounded by other rookies - thats fun, than be a rookie surrounded by pasty faced asset inheritors.  I am literally surrounded.
 
Uncanny experience number three is still unfolding.  I'm down on my numbers, fighting like a stone cold SOB to get them back up and the market goes into the toilet.  This isn't normal in the toilet - no, we got to get apocalyptic.  If I go down on the brink of a financial calamity I guess there's no shame in that.
 
I'm still itching to get in the ring with an asset inheritor.
Any takers?
 
I'm out.
 
 
 

Johnny Roast Beef's picture
Joined: 2008-02-12

glass man wrote:Hey Guys,
 
Great thread.  The honest bantering back and forth does a lot to alleviate my mood.
 
Being mostly transactional has definitely come back to bite me in the arse.  Jones only recently has come out with decent fee based offerings so being transactional wasn't only my own doing.
 
I feel like I'm a pretty decent bear market broker but the last two weeks has been difficult.  the news has been particularly catastrophic which puts even the good leads on slow motion.
 
I made a decision today to get back to using my gate keeper.  In a "crisis" I start fielding calls as they come in which kills my proactive work - which kills my business.
 
I've vented a bit on these forums but really I don't hold any grudge against asset inheritors.  I just realize they have a different job from me.  I don't accept lectures from asset inheritors though.  I'm ready to put the gloves on and step into the ring with some of these asset inheritors.  I'd honestly love that challenge.  One ring, two sets of gloves, and an even playing field. 
 
I must be a glutton for punishment because sometimes just finding other work seems like the "solution".  This year has been like a never ending marathon.  I've had a number of uncanny experiences at Jones.
 
Uncanny experience one - I was getting to the point where 15k was easy and I was in my first month where 15k was my quota.  That same month they announced they were raising it.  I understand they got to raise it but raising it the exact same month where I finally got my chin over the bar - even the most dyed in the wool company man has to say that's crappy timing.
 
Having good numbers and being in a region where 150 million got handed out and getting goose egged was uncanny experience number 2.  It's far better to be a rookie surrounded by other rookies - thats fun, than be a rookie surrounded by pasty faced asset inheritors.  I am literally surrounded.
 
Uncanny experience number three is still unfolding.  I'm down on my numbers, fighting like a stone cold SOB to get them back up and the market goes into the toilet.  This isn't normal in the toilet - no, we got to get apocalyptic.  If I go down on the brink of a financial calamity I guess there's no shame in that.
 
I'm still itching to get in the ring with an asset inheritor.
Any takers?
 
I'm out.
 
 
 
 
If you choose to survive this, you will.  At some point, you may survey the financial servces landscape and determine there is a better way for you, your family and your clients (indy, wirehouse, whatever).  You must be patient - this too, shall pass.  Don't hate your enemy, it clouds your judgement.  As an EDJ rep nothing frosted me like the fair haired boy presenting at regionals.  Do what must be done to ethically and legally meet their minimums.  I'll never regret my time at EDJ or my decison to go indy. 

Borker Boy's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-09

Look at joining a team at a wirehouse. Find out which area of expertise they're lacking in, and offer to fill it.
The idea of taking a team approach to wealth management, becoming a specialist in a particular area, and having others to help tow the line could be very exciting and rewarding. 

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