Smith Barney v. UBS

61 replies [Last post]
KUJAYHAWKS's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-31

I am making a career change - 13 years in sales with consumer products.
I have received offers from both Smith Barney and UBS in Chicago - the packages are very similar.  Does anyone have advice on these two companies?
I need to make my decision next week.

BigPayDay's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-01-10

KUHawks,

I have friends that work at both and are very happy. Niether started there however. Both had large books they transferred and took the up front check. Each has gone through a couple branch managers and this may be one of your challenges. I would interview each branch manager and find out more about them. Call some of the advisors at each branch and bend their ear a little bit. Talk to some of the vets as well as some of the new folks. This may also ne an opportunity to get to know some of the vest and maybe one of them would like to bring you in under his wing and/or as part of a team.

Also both firms will want to see you go after the High Net Worth client. This can be tough todo with only so many HNW out there and every major going after them. Would a HNW go with you a newbie or the vet. Probably the vet if given the choice. I would rather prospect a small pool of wealthy people verses a large pool of less wealthy people though. Just don't turn down all the less wealthy as you never know when you might get a rollover, referral or maybe they inherit money. I opened a lot of $2,000 IRA accounts early on in my career and many of them today are some of my top clients or referred me top clients.

I think either way you go it's a win/win and the bottom line is you couldn't be getting into a better industry at a better time. Good luck!

BPD

NOVA's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-01-11

I'm very happy at UBS....just wrapped up the training program and my first month of production.

ezmoney's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-30

Bigpayday,
Are you sure this is the best industry and best time to enter this biz??I see nothing but haircuts on payouts for the industry and heightened compliance issues. I think the SEC should experience a major overhaul.
 

rightway's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

ezmoney wrote:Bigpayday,
Are you sure this is the best industry and best time to enter this
biz??I see nothing but haircuts on payouts for the industry and
heightened compliance issues. I think the SEC should experience a major
overhaul.
 

SO negative.  Get another job.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Yes EZ it is the best time.  Look at it as glass half empty or half full.  The boomers are retiring, more assets on the table than ever before.  People that used to rely on defined benefit penisions are now becoming potential clients for advisors with rollover dollars.
The downturn in the market woke people up, they need some help and managing their nestegg in an E-trade account probably wasn't going to cut it.  I still believe now is the best time to be in the business, don't look at haircuts look at how much are you making per hour worked (mine goes up every year, as it should).

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

NOVA wrote:I'm very happy at UBS....just wrapped up the training program and my first month of production.
Good luck.  But you've hardly had time to see how things really work in this business.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

rightway wrote: ezmoney wrote:
Bigpayday,
Are you sure this is the best industry and best time to enter this biz??I see nothing but haircuts on payouts for the industry and heightened compliance issues. I think the SEC should experience a major overhaul.
 
SO negative.  Get another job.
I sorta agree.
Yes the regulatory stuff has gotten a little out of hand, but I think that is starting to change.
The payout haircuts seem to be mostly happening in the big bank programs, and for mid-level producers at the wirehouses.  There are plenty of other places to practice one's craft in this business.  I haven't heard anything about EdJones cutting payouts for example.  (Although I suppose rising toilet paper costs are creating a defacto small pay cut for IR's.)

FinclPlngPro's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-01

KUJAYHAWKS wrote:
I am making a career change - 13 years in sales with consumer products.
I have received offers from both Smith Barney and UBS in Chicago - the packages are very similar.  Does anyone have advice on these two companies?
I need to make my decision next week.

KU,
Joined SB and just completed the 3 weeks of live training in Hartford.  My production clock starts on 1-01-06.
For brand new people, there are a total of 18 weeks training,(if you are not licensed) on salary.  Total of 24 months on salary after for production date, with a declining scale over months 19-24.  Licensing & initial training is in-branch and the final three weeks are in Hartford.  Depending on your background and level of experience, the training will range from Very Good to OK. (I was a Series 7 & 66 as well as CFP already, so the Financial Planning training was somewhat boring..but NOT the case for others.)
I CANNOT STRESS THIS NEXT ITEM ENOUGH...Your branch manager controls everything in your life, in the branch, starting out.  that includes everything from paper clips to pencils to desks and chairs and office...or lack thereof.  Make sure your branch manager has a solid success history with new people...whether you chose SB or UBS.
RE: Focus on HNW.  This is true...but the good news is you have all the tools needed to target them.  SB is truly focused on Wealth Management vs. transactions...but they support both.  In my office their are 25 FAs.  Only three are on one team.  There are no other teams.  Biggest producer is semi transactional.  #2. is 100% managed money.  #3, #4 and #5 are a mix of both.  (#4 does more insurance than  half the branch added together.)
My branch manager has all the earmarks of a good manager...but only time can tell.  He is well thought of by the Vets...and that carried alot of weight with me. (I chose SB over ML...even though Merrill's offer was a little highter...because of the manager.) 
My ONLY disappointment at SB was finding out three weeks after I signed on the dotted line that SB does NOT allow FAs to charge fees for writting Financial Plans.  I asked my manager during the interview process if SB permitted "fee based financial planning" and he said yes.  However, we had different definitions of the words "fee based financial planning."  SB does have a fee based platform and it is preceeded by the preparation of a plan...but the plan itself is "free."  I accepted the responsibility for not being clear...but it was a big disappointment.
Good Luck in your choice and your career.
 

KUJAYHAWKS's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-31

Thank you for all of the responses.  I will decide this week.  I appreciate all of the info.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

FinclPlngPro wrote:KUJAYHAWKS wrote:
I am making a career change - 13 years in sales with consumer products.
I have received offers from both Smith Barney and UBS in Chicago - the packages are very similar.  Does anyone have advice on these two companies?
I need to make my decision next week.

KU,
Joined SB and just completed the 3 weeks of live training in Hartford.  My production clock starts on 1-01-06.
For brand new people, there are a total of 18 weeks training,(if you are not licensed) on salary.  Total of 24 months on salary after for production date, with a declining scale over months 19-24.  Licensing & initial training is in-branch and the final three weeks are in Hartford.  Depending on your background and level of experience, the training will range from Very Good to OK. (I was a Series 7 & 66 as well as CFP already, so the Financial Planning training was somewhat boring..but NOT the case for others.)
I CANNOT STRESS THIS NEXT ITEM ENOUGH...Your branch manager controls everything in your life, in the branch, starting out.  that includes everything from paper clips to pencils to desks and chairs and office...or lack thereof.  Make sure your branch manager has a solid success history with new people...whether you chose SB or UBS.
RE: Focus on HNW.  This is true...but the good news is you have all the tools needed to target them.  SB is truly focused on Wealth Management vs. transactions...but they support both.  In my office their are 25 FAs.  Only three are on one team.  There are no other teams.  Biggest producer is semi transactional.  #2. is 100% managed money.  #3, #4 and #5 are a mix of both.  (#4 does more insurance than  half the branch added together.)
My branch manager has all the earmarks of a good manager...but only time can tell.  He is well thought of by the Vets...and that carried alot of weight with me. (I chose SB over ML...even though Merrill's offer was a little highter...because of the manager.) 
My ONLY disappointment at SB was finding out three weeks after I signed on the dotted line that SB does NOT allow FAs to charge fees for writting Financial Plans.  I asked my manager during the interview process if SB permitted "fee based financial planning" and he said yes.  However, we had different definitions of the words "fee based financial planning."  SB does have a fee based platform and it is preceeded by the preparation of a plan...but the plan itself is "free."  I accepted the responsibility for not being clear...but it was a big disappointment.
Good Luck in your choice and your career.
 

I'm curious...if you're such a financial planning pro, why are you in the rookie training program? Does your first name start with the letter "K"?
Also, the firm doesn't charge for plans because people don't want plans. The firm is discouraging you from wasting everybody's time. People want to make money and you are paid for selling things that make money.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Dirk Diggler wrote:FinclPlngPro wrote:KUJAYHAWKS wrote:
I am making a career change - 13 years in sales with consumer products.
I have received offers from both Smith Barney and UBS in Chicago - the packages are very similar.  Does anyone have advice on these two companies?
I need to make my decision next week.

KU,
Joined SB and just completed the 3 weeks of live training in Hartford.  My production clock starts on 1-01-06.
For brand new people, there are a total of 18 weeks training,(if you are not licensed) on salary.  Total of 24 months on salary after for production date, with a declining scale over months 19-24.  Licensing & initial training is in-branch and the final three weeks are in Hartford.  Depending on your background and level of experience, the training will range from Very Good to OK. (I was a Series 7 & 66 as well as CFP already, so the Financial Planning training was somewhat boring..but NOT the case for others.)
I CANNOT STRESS THIS NEXT ITEM ENOUGH...Your branch manager controls everything in your life, in the branch, starting out.  that includes everything from paper clips to pencils to desks and chairs and office...or lack thereof.  Make sure your branch manager has a solid success history with new people...whether you chose SB or UBS.
RE: Focus on HNW.  This is true...but the good news is you have all the tools needed to target them.  SB is truly focused on Wealth Management vs. transactions...but they support both.  In my office their are 25 FAs.  Only three are on one team.  There are no other teams.  Biggest producer is semi transactional.  #2. is 100% managed money.  #3, #4 and #5 are a mix of both.  (#4 does more insurance than  half the branch added together.)
My branch manager has all the earmarks of a good manager...but only time can tell.  He is well thought of by the Vets...and that carried alot of weight with me. (I chose SB over ML...even though Merrill's offer was a little highter...because of the manager.) 
My ONLY disappointment at SB was finding out three weeks after I signed on the dotted line that SB does NOT allow FAs to charge fees for writting Financial Plans.  I asked my manager during the interview process if SB permitted "fee based financial planning" and he said yes.  However, we had different definitions of the words "fee based financial planning."  SB does have a fee based platform and it is preceeded by the preparation of a plan...but the plan itself is "free."  I accepted the responsibility for not being clear...but it was a big disappointment.
Good Luck in your choice and your career.
 

I'm curious...if you're such a financial planning pro, why are you in the rookie training program? Does your first name start with the letter "K"?
Also, the firm doesn't charge for plans because people don't want plans. The firm is discouraging you from wasting everybody's time. People want to make money and you are paid for selling things that make money.

Dirk,
While I somewhat agree with you, your just plain wrong and feel the need to educate you.  Smith Barney is a broker/dealer dabbling in the investment advisory business by offer fee based advice.  Currently, they are exempt from fiduciary responsibility which is required of investment advisors (RIA's) by a contraversial rule known as the "Merril rule".  With this come the obligation to let consumers know that "our interests may not be the same as yours"
The FPA sued the SEC earlier this year claiming anyone offering investment advice for a fee should be held to a fiduciary standard (which means doing what is in the best interests of your client rather than the best interests of your paycheck).  All the big boys fought this hard, because they do not want to be in that business.  In fact, if you look at Mr. Bush's top campaign donors for the past election they were Morgan Stanley #1 and down the list with other B/d's I am sure this is not the only reason for their large donations private SS is huge also....
Now, if you do what is best for your client do you see any problem with being held to a fiduciary standard?  I don't, but your employer does...... That is why many advisors have chosen to drop their Series 7 license and their affiliation with NASD and chose to work on a fee-only basis and be regulated by the SEC, these advisors are known not as Registered Reps, but as RIA's regulated by either their State or the SEC depending on asset levels
I still think handing the client a 50 page plan is stupid and charging them for it is even dumber.  I do however use 2 page projections, but rarely print them out....
Just a little history lesson....

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

So you somewhat agree with things that are just "plain wrong?"
You are a thinker and I am a doer.
You've overestimated my level of interest in your education. If people wanted FP's and were willing to pay for them, I'd be selling them.
I think you need to learn the difference between "fee based" and "asset based fees." That way, you won't look so silly when you post about this stuff.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Dirk,
I somewhat agree with you in saying people don't need or want plans.  They want a partner.
Fee based and asset based fees are one in the same, fee based brokerage is often passed off as paying for advice, but as Raymond James learned the hard way in 2005, the SEC/NASD is not going to have any of that. 
I doubt I look silly by stating the truth.

doberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-02-22

Simply selling products, outside the context of an overall financial plan, will come back to bite you when that particular investment product value heads south (and they will always head south). However, showing the client that a particular investment product is part of an overall plan will cause you and the client fewer headaches down the road.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

doberman wrote:Simply selling products, outside the context of an overall financial plan, will come back to bite you when that particular investment product value heads south (and they will always head south). However, showing the client that a particular investment product is part of an overall plan will cause you and the client fewer headaches down the road.
That's about the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time.

babbling looney's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

That's about the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time
Why do you think so?
 

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

babbling looney wrote:
That's about the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time
Why do you think so?
 

One product. If sold outside of a plan, it "always" heads south. If it is sold as part of a plan, it causes fewer headaches. Can a plan make something that always heads south, not head south? How do you explain the products that I've sold, with no plan, that haven't gone south?
Doberman is retarded for saying it and you're retarded for not seeing that Doberman is retarded.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

I have to agree with Dirk on this one.  Mr. & Mrs. Jones see on page 42 of your financial plan it says the market goes down sometimes, don't leave...
Of course I set goals with my clients, establish priorities etc.  I just don't think they need that in a 100 page document that they pay 1000 dollars for.  One of the biggest advisors I know used to do a plan for every person, he scrapped the idea about two years ago and now uses the goal/priority philosophy many advisors use.  That does not mean I don't use software, run projections etc.  It just means I am not going to analyze every need they don't have...

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

Dirk Diggler wrote:FinclPlngPro wrote:KUJAYHAWKS wrote:
I am making a career change - 13 years in sales with consumer products.
I have received offers from both Smith Barney and UBS in Chicago - the packages are very similar.  Does anyone have advice on these two companies?
I need to make my decision next week.

KU,
Joined SB and just completed the 3 weeks of live training in Hartford.  My production clock starts on 1-01-06.
For brand new people, there are a total of 18 weeks training,(if you are not licensed) on salary.  Total of 24 months on salary after for production date, with a declining scale over months 19-24.  Licensing & initial training is in-branch and the final three weeks are in Hartford.  Depending on your background and level of experience, the training will range from Very Good to OK. (I was a Series 7 & 66 as well as CFP already, so the Financial Planning training was somewhat boring..but NOT the case for others.)
I CANNOT STRESS THIS NEXT ITEM ENOUGH...Your branch manager controls everything in your life, in the branch, starting out.  that includes everything from paper clips to pencils to desks and chairs and office...or lack thereof.  Make sure your branch manager has a solid success history with new people...whether you chose SB or UBS.
RE: Focus on HNW.  This is true...but the good news is you have all the tools needed to target them.  SB is truly focused on Wealth Management vs. transactions...but they support both.  In my office their are 25 FAs.  Only three are on one team.  There are no other teams.  Biggest producer is semi transactional.  #2. is 100% managed money.  #3, #4 and #5 are a mix of both.  (#4 does more insurance than  half the branch added together.)
My branch manager has all the earmarks of a good manager...but only time can tell.  He is well thought of by the Vets...and that carried alot of weight with me. (I chose SB over ML...even though Merrill's offer was a little highter...because of the manager.) 
My ONLY disappointment at SB was finding out three weeks after I signed on the dotted line that SB does NOT allow FAs to charge fees for writting Financial Plans.  I asked my manager during the interview process if SB permitted "fee based financial planning" and he said yes.  However, we had different definitions of the words "fee based financial planning."  SB does have a fee based platform and it is preceeded by the preparation of a plan...but the plan itself is "free."  I accepted the responsibility for not being clear...but it was a big disappointment.
Good Luck in your choice and your career.
 

I'm curious...if you're such a financial planning pro, why are you in the rookie training program? Does your first name start with the letter "K"?
Also, the firm doesn't charge for plans because people don't want plans. The firm is discouraging you from wasting everybody's time. People want to make money and you are paid for selling things that make money.

After four months of training he ALREADY knows that SB gives him all the tools he needs to target high net worth investors? 

doberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-02-22

Dirk Diggler:
That's about the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time
One product. If sold outside of a plan, it "always" heads south. If it is sold as part of a plan, it causes fewer headaches. Can a plan make something that always heads south, not head south? How do you explain the products that I've sold, with no plan, that haven't gone south?
Doberman is retarded for saying it and you're retarded for not seeing that Doberman is retarded.
------------------------------------------
My statement that any investment always heads south, was meant to be tongue-in-cheek. It's obvious Dirk hasn't been in the business very long and still doesn't know how to read people. Hey Dirk, if you know of an investment that NEVER heads south, I'm sure the boards would love to know about it. And hey, I'm talking the last 30 years or so, not the couple of months you've been in the business.
Ok Dirk, let me draw you a picture so you can understand what I'm saying: Let's say you have 5 asset classes A, B, C, D, & E and your client (Joe) is invested in all five. (Are you with me so far?) And the purpose of investing this way is to reduce risk and improve returns (financial plan). (Still with me?) Ok, let's say asset class A drops by 15% one year. Well, Joe still has asset classes B thru E to pull-up the loss by A, plus Joe was educated about the benefits of asset allocation initially, so he knows to expect this sort of thing. VERSUS another client (Bob) who was only sold asset class A. Now Dirk, who do you think you're going to get the ACAT from first, Joe or Bob? 
Based on Dirk's statement, I believe he has a bunch of single investment clients, who will be acating him when the economic **** hits the fan. And mark my words on this, IT WILL HIT THE FAN!
Alas, Dirk's youthful inexperience is quite obvious when he resorts to name calling when confronted with an issue he knows little or nothing about. Agree or disagree, but in any case, you need to grow up and respond like an adult. ( I can see Dirk now, pitching a prospect that his current broker is "retarded".) 
I wish I had Dirk's client list.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

Doberman,
If you have money in all asset classes, you are destined to own the worst performing asset class. Does that make you proud? Are you with me so far?
My clients were up 20-23%, net, in 2005. Still with me? Stay with me, now. How much do you think I had in the worst performing asset classes? Humor me with an answer, ok?
See if you can keep up with me, on this...I didn't prepare a financial plan to accomplish this. Try to follow this...my clients would rather have what they have than your little plan. Are you with me?

doberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-02-22

Hey Dirk, keep that attitude about being a "stockbroker wizard" and we'll be reading about you being "fined and banned from the business" on Bill Singer's website.
So Dirk, how did your clients do in 2000-2002? Oh, that's right, you weren't even in the business then. Geesh!!
Now, hush and let the adults talk!

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

doberman wrote:
Hey Dirk, keep that attitude about being a "stockbroker wizard" and we'll be reading about you being "fined and banned from the business" on Bill Singer's website.
So Dirk, how did your clients do in 2000-2002? Oh, that's right, you weren't even in the business then. Geesh!!
Now, hush and let the adults talk!

Been in business since late 1999.  
2000 +4.8%
2001 -2.2%
2002 -12.2%
Are you with me? I doubt it.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Dirk,
Your way to arrogant, chill.  So your telling me that you think you will be able to consistently switch asset classes and not burn your clients or miss returns by being underweighted in the asset class that outperforms?  I am not criticizing, however, I know this is simply not possible.
Please share your strategy for determing which asset class is going to outperform.  How would you invest 100K for 2006?  Humor me. 

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

bankrep1 wrote:
Dirk,
Your way to arrogant, chill.  So your telling me that you think you will be able to consistently switch asset classes and not burn your clients or miss returns by being underweighted in the asset class that outperforms?  I am not criticizing, however, I know this is simply not possible.
Please share your strategy for determing which asset class is going to outperform.  How would you invest 100K for 2006?  Humor me. 

It's a waste of time to explain it to you. You're a bank broker. You can't do what I do. Suffice it to say that I don't invest in asset classes for the sake of investing in asset classes. They are not relevant to what I do.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Dirk,
Humor me.  How would you invest 100K for 2006.  I have the same licenses you have and probably a few more considering you didn't even know about the Merril rule.  I am sure I will understand.  If not someone else here will explain it I am sure. 
Are you using portable alpha or some form of technical analysis.  Humor me, since your strategy does not involve asset class specifically where are you placing money for 2006?

Cowboy93's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-10

Posted: Dec. 20 2005 at 9:16pm | IP Logged

I am amazed at the amount of posts some of you manage to put up.  I mean I have been pretty active here lately, but most of my posts are at night.  I log on from one day to the next and a discussion I was involved in has morphed to a totally different topic 10 pages later.
------------------------
bankrep1--see your post above; also note that the topic at hand is someone enterting the business wanting advice re: UBS vs. SB.  I believe you're contributing to the "morphing" w/your debate on asset allocation/timing.
Jayhawk--I don't think choosing between the two firms will determine your fate; as many people here will tell you, the local situation is far more important.  But primarily your skills, determination, common sense, persistence, luck, prior contacts, yada yada yada will determine the end of the story.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

bankrep1 wrote:
Dirk,
Humor me.  How would you invest 100K for 2006.  I have the same licenses you have and probably a few more considering you didn't even know about the Merril rule.  I am sure I will understand.  If not someone else here will explain it I am sure. 
Are you using portable alpha or some form of technical analysis.  Humor me, since your strategy does not involve asset class specifically where are you placing money for 2006?

It's not a license thing. If you're a bank rep, I'm sure you are licensed to do everything I do. You just aren't ALLOWED to do what I do. You've overestimated my level of interest in humoring you. I'll share with you, in private, for $20,000. It's a waste of your money, since you can't  use it anyway.
I hope you get to work on time, tomorrow, employee boy.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Cowboy good call, it is nighttime.  I will start a new thread on the topic.  See Dirk...Full of shizt

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

bankrep1 wrote:Cowboy good call, it is nighttime.  I will start a new thread on the topic.  See Dirk...Full of shizt
Why are you obsessed with me? That's kind of gay, don't you think?
Go get in your jammies, so you can go to your cubicle in the bank, wide-eyed and bushy-tailed, and get a haircut before your 37% payout.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

bankrep1 wrote: Smith Barney is a broker/dealer dabbling in the investment advisory business by offer fee based advice. 
You're confusing fee in lieu of commission accounts with discretionary accounts like SMAs. Firms like SB do both. BTW, the FPA (of which I am a member) lost in their fight with the SEC for good reason. They essentially wanted brokerages governed by two sets of rules while they were happy to be governed by the one set that covers themselves now.<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

Dirk Diggler wrote: <?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />
 
Can a plan make something that always heads south, not head south? How do you explain the products that I've sold, with no plan, that haven't gone south?

 
Can you name “something” that always goes south?
 
Dirk Diggler wrote:
If you have money in all asset classes, you are destined to own the worst performing asset class.

Can you tell us how you know, in advance, what will be the worst performing sector and how you avoid it?
 Dirk Diggler wrote:
Been in business since late 1999.  

Lol…
Dirk Diggler wrote:
 
2000 +4.8%
2001 -2.2%
2002 -12.2%

Say, if you avoid the worst sector, as you claim, how did you lose money in 2001 and 2002?
Dirk Diggler wrote:
 
 
 
It's not a license thing. If you're a bank rep, I'm sure you are licensed to do everything I do. You just aren't ALLOWED to do what I do.
 

 
So he has the same licenses as you, but can’t do what you do. Care to explain it to us all? I mean, it isn’t as if I’m losing sleep wondering what a new guy to the business is doing that’s caused him relatively low returns (roughly up less than 10% cumulative since 2000 by the numbers you provided), but I am curious how you’ll spin this next. If a bank broker can’t do what you do, who can?
 
Dirk Diggler wrote:
Why are you obsessed with me? That's kind of gay, don't you think?
 
 
Anyone else here notice the quick refuge to the ‘you’re gay” thing? Sounds familiar, doesn’t it? Also sounds like someone in denial, but that’s a subject for another thread.
 
 
 

babbling looney's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

doberman wrote:Dirk Diggler:
That's about the most retarded thing I've heard in a long time
One product. If sold outside of a plan, it "always" heads south. If it is sold as part of a plan, it causes fewer headaches. Can a plan make something that always heads south, not head south? How do you explain the products that I've sold, with no plan, that haven't gone south?
Doberman is retarded for saying it and you're retarded for not seeing that Doberman is retarded.
------------------------------------------
My statement that any investment always heads south, was meant to be tongue-in-cheek. It's obvious Dirk hasn't been in the business very long and still doesn't know how to read people. Hey Dirk, if you know of an investment that NEVER heads south, I'm sure the boards would love to know about it. And hey, I'm talking the last 30 years or so, not the couple of months you've been in the business.
Ok Dirk, let me draw you a picture so you can understand what I'm saying: Let's say you have 5 asset classes A, B, C, D, & E and your client (Joe) is invested in all five. (Are you with me so far?) And the purpose of investing this way is to reduce risk and improve returns (financial plan). (Still with me?) Ok, let's say asset class A drops by 15% one year. Well, Joe still has asset classes B thru E to pull-up the loss by A, plus Joe was educated about the benefits of asset allocation initially, so he knows to expect this sort of thing. VERSUS another client (Bob) who was only sold asset class A. Now Dirk, who do you think you're going to get the ACAT from first, Joe or Bob? 
Based on Dirk's statement, I believe he has a bunch of single investment clients, who will be acating him when the economic **** hits the fan. And mark my words on this, IT WILL HIT THE FAN!
Alas, Dirk's youthful inexperience is quite obvious when he resorts to name calling when confronted with an issue he knows little or nothing about. Agree or disagree, but in any case, you need to grow up and respond like an adult. ( I can see Dirk now, pitching a prospect that his current broker is "retarded".) 
I wish I had Dirk's client list.

Selling someone "an" investment without educating them as to what that investment's function in the overall plan is asking for an unhappy client when the investment doesn't perform to expectations.   It is not "retarded" (nanny nanny boo boo).  This doesn't mean that there needs to be a formal written expensive plan that we can reference page 43 sub paragraph b.  If the client has faith and a vision of the future, blips in the portfolio are much easier overlooked than if the investment stands alone. Instilling faith or a vision in the future will keep the client from bailing on you. It is our job to be "advisors" and not to be the used car salesmen/women of the financial industry. We need to help our clients create a plan, educate them on how to stick to the plan and be able to adjust it if needs arise AND let the client know we are working WITH them to accomplish something.
And to change the subject again to something wildly off topic.  I think this lack of faith in anything and inability to envision beyond yesterday or tomorrow is the big problem with the secular left.  This leads to their determination to create defeat in our foreign policy and bring us to economic disaster.  The same issues cause our clients (to whom we haven't given the inner fortitude to be able to weather difficult times) to give up at the worst of times. 
Don't bother responding to this political observation as I won't either.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

Golly! Was I supposed to explain what the investments do and why we're doing it? I'm so glad I met you guys. I'll give it a try. Thanks.

babbling looney's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02
Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

babbling looney wrote:
 
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/2883/bozo20pd0ov.jpg

You're pretty funny for a woman.

Duke#1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-06

Dirk, quoting your clients' rates of return (good or bad) are meaningless unless they're applicable to clients with the same investment objective, time horizon, risk tolerance, liquidity needs, & tax status  (or fit one segment of a client's overall asset allocation). 
For example, for certain of my clients' equity exposure I could have used my b/d's "analysts best picks" & they would have gotten about 22% last year and averaged about 19% over the last 5 years (before transaction costs).  But, that rate of return is only applicable to that one investment allocation, and that allocation was certainly not appropriate for all my clients.  It's not representative of my clients' overall rate of return unless all my clients were exactly the same, with that portfolio fitting their entire investment allocation (unlikely if not impossible).  So, I assume you have a very narrow niche of clients having the exact same investment objectives, etc., or you are only managing an isolated portion of your client's money, with other advisors handling the rest of their money.  Right?
Similarly, quoting rates of return for a particular asset class are only relevant when compared to an applicable money manager peer group or index.
So, while I understand you wouldn't want to divulge how you do what you do to obtain the rates of return you quoted, at least how about giving us the details of your client profile so that you can shed some validity to the absolute numbers you quote?  And, similarly, how about telling us something about your management style, etc. and how this relates to peer group managers and/or indices?  You wouldn't be divulging anything proprietary about what you do; it would just give some credence to the numbers you quoted as achieving for your "clients".

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Dirk does not manage money he spends his time making up stories about managing money.  He is probably and IT guy or engineer who can't wait to quit his crappy job because his boss treats him like dirt , but is not aloud because his wife won't let him.

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

bankrep1 wrote:Dirk does not manage money he spends his time making up stories about managing money.  He is probably and IT guy or engineer who can't wait to quit his crappy job because his boss treats him like dirt , but is not aloud because his wife won't let him.
You're right. I don't manage money. I place money. I get paid 7.5% of every dollar that I place. It's pretty easy with this track record.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

Dirk Diggler wrote:
bankrep1 wrote:Dirk does not manage money he spends his time making up stories about managing money.  He is probably and IT guy or engineer who can't wait to quit his crappy job because his boss treats him like dirt , but is not aloud because his wife won't let him.
You're right. I don't manage money. I place money. I get paid 7.5% of every dollar that I place. It's pretty easy with this track record.

So what we have here is annuity only guy bashing a bank guy? Let me guess, every dime goes to the JNL contract, right? Just how is that something a bank guy couldn't do, as you've said? One of the hits bank guys take is that they shove people into annuities. (not making a judgment call here, just mentioning the seterotype) 

Dirk Diggler's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-30

mikebutler222 wrote:Dirk Diggler wrote:
bankrep1 wrote:Dirk does not manage money he spends his time making up stories about managing money.  He is probably and IT guy or engineer who can't wait to quit his crappy job because his boss treats him like dirt , but is not aloud because his wife won't let him.
You're right. I don't manage money. I place money. I get paid 7.5% of every dollar that I place. It's pretty easy with this track record.

So what we have here is annuity only guy bashing a bank guy? Let me guess, every dime goes to the JNL contract, right? Just how is that something a bank guy couldn't do, as you've said? One of the hits bank guys take is that they shove people into annuities. (not making a judgment call here, just mentioning the seterotype) 

Yep.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

Not for 'nuthin, but you fellas have completely hijacked this thread....
Hey guys, you know Dirk's methodology may not meet your tastes, but I know this guy makes some major bank and good returns for his clients....and lots of business from referrals from what I understand.

badplaid's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-09-10

BEWARE OF THE PHOG!!!!
 
 

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

joedabrkr wrote:
Not for 'nuthin, but you fellas have completely hijacked this thread....
Hey guys, you know Dirk's methodology may not meet your tastes, but I know this guy makes some major bank and good returns for his clients....and lots of business from referrals from what I understand.

Do you know dirk?

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

badplaid wrote:
BEWARE OF THE PHOG!!!!
 
 

huh?

BrokerRecruit's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-04-19

It's a KU thing.  Phog Allen - former KU coach and namesake for Allen Fieldhouse on campus.  Served as coach for 30+ years and is a Hall of Famer, if I'm not mistaken.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

BrokerRecruit wrote:It's a KU thing.  Phog Allen - former KU coach and namesake for Allen Fieldhouse on campus.  Served as coach for 30+ years and is a Hall of Famer, if I'm not mistaken.
thx.  I was confused.
The HORNS are gonne CREAM USC tonight!

badplaid's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-09-10

It's a KU thing.  Phog Allen was a legendary coach at KU. 
Isn't this thread about KU? 
Game against some Yale blowhards tonight in B-Ball..... Kentucky this weekend.
Ft. Worth Bowl Champions in Football.( i can hear the chuckles)
Women BBall are 12-0, just wiped up Texas last night.
Rooooccckkk Challllkkkk Jayhaaaawkkk K U!!!!

blarmston's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-02-26

I cant say anything right now. My beloved Huskies got WAXED by Marquette last night... I sat there downing some jack and cokes... it wasnt pretty.. I punched my wall and now my hand is killing me... Yup... definately not the smartest sometimes...

KUJAYHAWKS's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-12-31

I took the offer from Smith Barney today.  Thanks for the feedback.  Glad to see some Jayhawks out there!

Please or Register to post comments.

Industry Newsletters
Investment Category Sponsor Links

 

Careers Category Sponsor Links

Sponsored Introduction Continue on to (or wait seconds) ×