NASD Newbie

40 replies [Last post]
kujhawks's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-08-22

This is my first (but not last) post.

I have been reviewing the archives and I notice that NASD Newbie offers
some negative insights into young men who are entering into the
industry. I am 24 years old and have trained at Oppenheimer only to
make a switch to a major wirehouse and complete their training program.
One argument often presented by NASD Newbie and many others is, "no one
will trust a 24 year old child with his retirement assets", while this
argument has merit it should be examined in further detail. Why do most
young adults fail in this industry? The answer is a lack of maturity.
Most 24 year olds lack maturity and it is evident in the way that they
present themselves to their prospects. This is not to say that all 24
years olds and the like lack maturity. It should be noted that many
young adults entering into this industry are very well educated and
come from backgrounds that would put most of us to shame. I am not one
to make assumptions, but just by passing the series 7 alone an advisor
in the industry has established some credibility. I must counter with
the question, why do these wirehouses spend lots of money in salary and
health benefits if the presumption is that young adults cannont make it
in the industry? Are the naieve? Or could it be that success at a young
age should be examined on an individual basis rather than the
population as a whole? In the words of Bill O'Reilly, pithy comments
are appreciated, and remember, no bloviating.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

The only people who think that 24 year olds are "mature" are other 24 year olds.
Well educated?  Compared to what?  If you think you're well educated compared to a fifty year old man who is also well educated you're wrong.  Not only did the older guy get educated when there were standards in the schools, he has a twenty-five year head start on learning the elusive "lessons of life."
Passing Series 7 builds credibility?  How does that work?  Your clients don't know what it is, much less if it's hard or easy.  A passing score is 70%--that means you can pass even though you don't know 30% of what you're supposed to know.
Get back with us when you get a CFP, that is the only designation that offers a bit of crediblity.
What you children keep failing to recognize is that it's more than being able to explain something you learned somewhere along the way--it's the ability to get the investor to write a check.
Do not mistake going out on a date with having a proposal of marriage accepted.
And don't go admire yourself in the mirror and conclude that you "look mature for your age."  You don't.
Y'all seem to think that somebody who is 50 doesn't know what it is like to be 25--they do, and 30, and 35, and 40, and 45.  They're going to blow your young butt away in any competition you attempt to engage in.
I was twenty-four--and when I was I was the smartest, best looking, most motivated person on earth.  Just like every other 24 year old.
You may not believe this, but I had a lot to learn.  Still do.

Philo Kvetch's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-17

"You may not believe this, but I had a lot to learn.  Still do."
Far more than you can even imagine, Putsy.

knucklehead's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-07-27

Philo Kvetch wrote:
"You may not believe this, but I had a lot to learn.  Still do."
Far more than you can even imagine, Putsy.

I miss jymmym. He was a much better loser than this guy.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

knucklehead wrote:Philo Kvetch wrote:
"You may not believe this, but I had a lot to learn.  Still do."
Far more than you can even imagine, Putsy.

I miss jymmym. He was a much better loser than this guy.

How would a guy who joined last month know somebody who I have never heard of, yet I've been here for about a year?
I suspect there is but one drunk lying beside the building as the rest of us walk by--and he alternates between Philo/Knucklehead/Starka and others.
Filled with inner rage due to a string of failures that he thinks is bad luck.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

I hate to agree with Newbie but I do. I am in my 30's have the CFP and fight hard for credibility a 50 year gets just by being old (which shows the ignorance of our society).

At 24 you can conquer the world (good for you), just wait until you fail a bit then you'll be brought back to reality (one of lives lessons). You must fail many many times before you'll succeed a concept a 24 year old whose invincible won't get until they are older.

Like I have said a million times start at a fund company or as an assistant, you'll appreciate the advice when you join the million dollar club.

Philo Kvetch's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-17

Luck is what you make it, Putsy.
Even if your statement was true (which coincidentally it's not, but that's nothing new for you), it pales by comparison with your proliferation of aliases on these boards.  People who live in glass houses and all that notwithstanding, your problem is that you simply can't stand it when others show up the numerous fallacies in your arguments.  Personally, I don't care how wrong you are...makes no difference to me.  What I object to is the fact that if someone new to our business heeds your putrid nonsense, they can very well end up in deep regulatory water, being fined monies that they don't have and possibly ending what might be a promising career, all for the sake of your amusement.
I find that trait in you, Putsy/Lieberman/Big Easy/NASD Newbie/ et al, to be despicable. 

Lieberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-08-22

Philo Kvetch wrote:What I object to is the fact that if someone new to our business heeds your putrid nonsense, they can very well end up in deep regulatory water, being fined monies that they don't have and possibly ending what might be a promising career, all for the sake of your amusement.
I find that trait in you, Putsy/Lieberman/Big Easy/NASD Newbie/ et al, to be despicable.  First of all, don't lump me into your "Putsy" fetish.  Secondly, yes, if you feel that specific comments could create a regulatory mess, let's hear about it.  However, your only posts lately are two line hate responses to his posts.  No one cares to read that, Philo.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

bankrep1 wrote:I hate to agree with Newbie but I do. I am in my 30's have the CFP and fight hard for credibility a 50 year gets just by being old (which shows the ignorance of our society). At 24 you can conquer the world (good for you), just wait until you fail a bit then you'll be brought back to reality (one of lives lessons). You must fail many many times before you'll succeed a concept a 24 year old whose invincible won't get until they are older. Like I have said a million times start at a fund company or as an assistant, you'll appreciate the advice when you join the million dollar club.
First, fifty is not old--it is older, but it is not old.  Your prime earnings years will be from 50 to 65.
Second, Bankrep is just another example of how uneducated you kids are--you actually do not know things like the two I underlined in the above discussion.
I realize that this is a message board not a term paper--but those words are not misspelled so your spell checker will not stop on them.
It is illustrative of what I have talked about regarding why the wirehouses found it necessary to morph into asset gatherers--it's a sad commentary on our society but if you're under age 40 you are just not very well educated.
Nobody ever corrected you because to do so would hurt your self esteem, and starting about the time you kids were in grade school things like self esteem and an acceptance of diversity became more important than your ability to read, write and sum.
It seems benign enough, does it really matter if you can't spell as long as you can be understood?  Perhaps when you're older and nobody can spell it won't matter, but as long as those of us who can are still alive and making the decisions that affect your lives you'd be wise to be attempt to "connect" with us.
Your day will come, and some twenty-five year old college graduate will write a letter filled with misspelled words--but it won't matter because you won't know they're misspelled.
Eventually the smartest man in town will be the doctor, and all he will know is that it's a bad idea to pee in the river upstream from where the people get their drinking water.
 

Philo Kvetch's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-17

You joined under the moniker 'Lieberman' yesterday, Putsy.
Give it a break, will ya?

Lieberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-08-22

Wrong again, Phil.  Your last names suits you well, however.
Give it a break, will ya?

Philo Kvetch's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-17

Lieberman wrote:
Wrong again, Phil.  Your last names suits you well, however.
Give it a break, will ya?

August 22, 2006 was yesterday, Putsy. 
Where is that wrong?

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

Philo Kvetch wrote:Lieberman wrote:
Wrong again, Phil.  Your last names suits you well, however.
Give it a break, will ya?

August 22, 2006 was yesterday, Putsy. 
Where is that wrong?He has so many multiple personalities that he's losing track of which one did what and when!!!

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

joedabrkr wrote: Philo Kvetch wrote:Lieberman wrote:
Wrong again, Phil.  Your last names suits you well, however.
Give it a break, will ya?

August 22, 2006 was yesterday, Putsy. 
Where is that wrong?
He has so many multiple personalities that he's losing track of which one did what and when!!!
What makes you two dimbulbs conclude that I use more than one name?
I'll join Lieberman and assure you that he and I are not the same person.

compliancejerk's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-03

I started this subject and my first post has been censured (deleted). So be it.  NASD Newbie is IMHO a dangerous poster. The more we answer his posts the more brazen he becomes in spewing his out-dated drivel.  I feel his only reason to be on this post is to feel important.  Unfortunately he is a pathetic has-been that has more time to spend on this board than with family or friends and has to post pics of his life to feel alive. Just check the frequency of his posts, not to mention times of day.
As in my first post, I suggest that we ignore this poster rather than waste our time and letting his posts get the better of us.

compliancejerk's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-03

Okay I'm a bit lazy and didn't check the "General" subjects and my original post wasn't censured.  It's still there.  It's not like I am confused about discretion or what compliance and branch managers do.
I still say that NASD Newbie is a dangerous poster.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

Without citing examples of where I'm wrong you come across as just another whiner.
Tell me where I'm wrong.  Don't tell me that I'd be wrong if I worked where you work, tell me I"d be wrong according to the NASD manual.

Lieberman's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-08-22

NASD Newbie wrote:I'll join Lieberman and assure you that he and I are not the same person. Hey NASD - how do you know that I am a "he?"

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

Lieberman wrote:
NASD Newbie wrote:I'll join Lieberman and assure you that he and I are not the same person. Hey NASD - how do you know that I am a "he?"

Good Point, you may be a doll.

apprentice's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-06-06

Wow - clash of the egos.  Again, NASD Newbie - where do you ever find time to produce?
Anyway, kujhawks - age is only an issue when you make it an issue.  Don't let us old farts discourage you from joining the club.

Boomer's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-04-01

NASD Newbie....is there a way I can PM you something (your box if full)

Boomer's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-04-01

Ok...for the crowd that is opposed to youngsters becoming FA's, I would
like to hear other options. I am a recent graduate, and have been
interviewing for a number of different roles. I have been offered to
become a FA at a top 3 wirehouse, but I am also looking into other
avenues.

What would you have a young man do if he knows he wants to become an
FA in the futue?

I have spoken to many wirehouse FA's and a few managers and I have
gotten different answers. A few say jump in now. A few say get a support
role for a few years.

There has been alot of "young guys can not make it in this industry" talk
but what is your idea of where to begin?

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

Boomer wrote:NASD Newbie....is there a way I can PM you something (your box if full)
Imagine that, all the people communicating with this nasty old man.  I'll take care of it.

xej1984's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-30

NASD Newbie wrote:
Boomer wrote:NASD Newbie....is there a way I can PM you something (your box if full)
Imagine that, all the people communicating with this nasty old man.  I'll take care of it.

I didn't know one could PM themselves. Hey newbie how'd you get away with that?

anonymous's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-09-29

Boomer, the problem with being a young financial advisor at a wirehouse is that reps at wirehouses are not financial advisors.  They are asset gatherers. 
Your peer group does not have money thus you can't succeed at gathering their assets because they don't have any.  Young people can definitely succeed in this business, but with few exceptions, they have to go to a place where they can make money doing things other than gathering assets.  Personally, I think that a top flight insurance agency is one good place to start.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Boomer,

Get your CFP education, network through the FPA, become a paraplanner for a few years, then a Jr. planner, planner, and finally an asset gatherer/relationship mgr. you could do this at an indy shop or wirehouse, however, alot of planners value independence and have set up their own shops. Bloomberg wealth manager magazine posts the top 500 fee based firms each year, use this to find possible places to explore these opportunities. Also commit to education and join the FPA now. Your success rate is 75% plus if you take that route.

Other ideas include working as an internal wholesaler for a fund or insurance company. Eventually you can go external and find a place where you would like to become an advisor, the only downside here is wholesalers make good coin, they work alot and that maybe hard to walk away from, I like my first idea best.

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Newbie successful people don't have time to proofread posts. I enjoy sharing ideas and correcting idiots like yourself, maybe you as an english prof. find similar amusement, however, you're on the wrong board if you're expecting anyone to appreciate your compulsive nature.

Why don't you correct people when they make errors like saying you should have your trust as beneficiary on all of your IRA accounts. That would be more productive and add some value to this board, I am sure most people here don't realize this is a big no no in most cases.

anonymous's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-09-29

I have to disagree with bankrep on this one.  If you are going to be successful in this industry, you have to learn to sell.  The planning part is easy part.    There are two skills that are needed to succeed in this business.  1)The ability to get in front of people on a favorable basis.  2)The ability to sell.
I would think that a sales job of any type is better training than being a paraplanner.  The paraplanners who I know have almost no chance to succeed in this business beyond paraplanning because they don't have the skillset.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

anonymous wrote:
Boomer, the problem with being a young financial advisor at a wirehouse is that reps at wirehouses are not financial advisors.  They are asset gatherers. 
 
Meaning?

Boomer's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-04-01

Thanks for all the ideas guys...

Philo Kvetch's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-05-17

NASD Newbie wrote:joedabrkr wrote: Philo Kvetch wrote:Lieberman wrote:
Wrong again, Phil.  Your last names suits you well, however.
Give it a break, will ya?

August 22, 2006 was yesterday, Putsy. 
Where is that wrong?
He has so many multiple personalities that he's losing track of which one did what and when!!!
What makes you two dimbulbs conclude that I use more than one name?
I'll join Lieberman and assure you that he and I are not the same person.

Try to imagine how much your assurances are worth to me and other people of integrity.  That is, of course, if anyone with integrity has ever let you close.

troll's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-11-29

mikebutler222 wrote:anonymous wrote:
Boomer, the problem with being a young financial advisor at a wirehouse is that reps at wirehouses are not financial advisors.  They are asset gatherers. 
 
Meaning? Mike I think what he's getting at is that you are an exception that generally proves the rule......

bankrep1's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-02

Anonymous,

I understand your point, but generally the folks that belong to the FPA are interested in promoting a career path within financial planning they are committed to changing the business for the better. They will teach you to sell when your ready and will not make you fly or fail like a wirehouse will.   I truly believe the wirehouses that don't change to a financial planning mindset will be out of business someday.

If you don't believe financial planning is the future of our industry you simply don't get it and that is why I suggest a new person align with a true planner rather than someone who pretends to be one ( I am not saying you have to have the CFP to be a true planner, you have to have the knowledge though).

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

bankrep1 wrote:Anonymous, I understand your point, but generally the folks that belong to the FPA are interested in promoting a career path within financial planning they are committed to changing the business for the better. They will teach you to sell when your ready and will not make you fly or fail like a wirehouse will.   I truly believe the wirehouses that don't change to a financial planning mindset will be out of business someday. If you don't believe financial planning is the future of our industry you simply don't get it and that is why I suggest a new person align with a true planner rather than someone who pretends to be one ( I am not saying you have to have the CFP to be a true planner, you have to have the knowledge though).
That knowledge would be as solid as, "Earnings always go up, therefore stock prices will always go up."
Bankrep, you have made the single dumbest statement ever made regarding investing--plus you hide out in the bank channel because you're afraid to grow up and swim in the deep end.
You have zero credibility.

peacock's picture
Offline
Joined: 2004-12-09

It seems to me that this is being over analyzed.  If you're young and you work hard, you will make it in the business.  However it's not easy.  I started when I was 22.  I'm now 27, have 25 million AUM (20 is feed based) and am independent.  I didn't do anything special, just lots of prospecting.  I'll continue to build for the future.  It's not rocket science, just prospect and build relationships. 

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

peacock wrote:
It seems to me that this is being over analyzed.  If you're young and you work hard, you will make it in the business.  However it's not easy.  I started when I was 22.  I'm now 27, have 25 million AUM (20 is feed based) and am independent.  I didn't do anything special, just lots of prospecting.  I'll continue to build for the future.  It's not rocket science, just prospect and build relationships. 

Feed based is always best--the human gets hungry every several hours.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

Do the boys and girls understand that the idea of fee based business is relatively new and there is no guarantee that the public will continue to be receptive to the idea?
It's easy to come to grips with the fact that money is simply disappearing from your account when the market is rising, but when it falls fees being sucked out in addition to the losses will irritate a priest much less the typical client.
Do you suppose firms like Vanguard are just waiting for the right time to start a massive advertising campaign with the message being, "If you're disappointed with your results last year remember that Vanguard has a complete family of funds with fees that vary from none to very low."
Print ads that educate the investor on how to read their statements to see how much they're paying you for doing something close to nothing.
Most clients with investable assets are college educated--it's crazy to think that they're not smart enough to do their own mutual fund selection.  As people keep saying, "It's not rocket science."

vbrainy's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-07-26

NASD Newbie wrote:
bankrep1 wrote:Anonymous, I understand your point, but generally the folks that belong to the FPA are interested in promoting a career path within financial planning they are committed to changing the business for the better. They will teach you to sell when your ready and will not make you fly or fail like a wirehouse will.   I truly believe the wirehouses that don't change to a financial planning mindset will be out of business someday. If you don't believe financial planning is the future of our industry you simply don't get it and that is why I suggest a new person align with a true planner rather than someone who pretends to be one ( I am not saying you have to have the CFP to be a true planner, you have to have the knowledge though).
That knowledge would be as solid as, "Earnings always go up, therefore stock prices will always go up."
Bankrep, you have made the single dumbest statement ever made regarding investing--plus you hide out in the bank channel because you're afraid to grow up and swim in the deep end.
You have zero credibility.

There is nothing wrong with being a Financial Advisor at a Bank.
YOU are the zero.
Exactly what deep end do you swim in?  From what I hear, your license has been revoked and you have ZERO current customers.

apprentice's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-06-06

Newbie - fee based business is about as new as the microwave oven.  Or do you still believe that that concept won't catch on either?  As I've said - you can manage relationships (with consultant supported fee programs) or you can sit in your office and be an order taker, like Pavlov's dog everytime the phone rings.
Newbie - I didn't spell check my message, can you please do it for me?  I also need a grammar check when you have a moment.

NASD Newbie's picture
Offline
Joined: 2005-08-01

Fee based business is not new but the idea of adding a middle man, the Investment Advisor Representative, is new to the last ten to fifteen years.  Time flies when you're having fun.
What is still an unknown is how the customers will react when they begin to pay attention to their returns because the returns are negative.
There are a lot of people--including me--who believe that when you start to show them negative returns huge portions of your book are going to want to move their accounts away from you.  Why should they be paying fees for negative advice?
They understand that the fund manager has to be paid, they expect that.  But just what is that guy who sold me the fund in the first place doing dipping his hand into the collection plate, I haven't bought anything from him in several years yet he keeps taking several hundred dollars a year out of my account!
Next thing you know some lawyer is demanding that you explain yourself. The lawyer is like Mr. Cole, he won't get paid unless his client collects so to make it worth his while he'll convince his new plaintiff, your ex-customer, to sue you for what they lost PLUS three times that much in order to teach you and your firm to not do it again.
The "I promise to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth" day rolls around and you hear the client say that they had no idea you were getting cut of their account.  Besides that they have no recollection of having talked to you since they signed that paperwork so long ago.
The panel listens to them with a healthy dose of skepticism then it's your turn.
You tell them that you were in constant contact with the client, and that every year you gave them a very nice annual review--why you even had it bound in one of those comb binder deals over at Kinkos.  That cost you an extra $1.50 just to demonstrate how much you care for them as clients.
There is more back and forth--you're portrayed as a ganster out to defraud your client and your client is portrayed by your attorney as a dishonest person trying to get their money back in spite of the fact that they understood the risks.
Finally, after several hours it all comes to an end.  You're told that a decision will be made within thirty days.
about three weeks later you get the word, the panel has decided to split the sheets, so to speak.  They're going to give the client back the lost money plus 6% interest.  They have decided to not award punative damages because they don't believe you lied to the client, just that you were not as forthcoming as you could have been.
So the client gets back the $9,000 they lost plus 6% interest.  How much of that will your firm make you eat?  How does your E&O coverge kick in, if at all?
It doesn't really matter--it's the time lost in the whole affair that is the big negative.  What are you going to do if ten, fifteen, twenty or more people all decided to do it at the same time?
Don't think it can't happen--people are funny about their money. Mothers sue sons all the time--not every day or something but several times a year a major firm will be served with papers demanding a hearing where a parent is suing their own child--mostly the firm and the manager for failing to supervise that broker who just happened to be the client's son.

The Judge's picture
Offline
Joined: 2006-06-06

NASD Newbie has made some good points.  As I've previously stated, I've been a proponent of fee-based arrangements (where appropriate) from day 1.  I took a lot of clients out of the market in late 99/early 2000 as I felt the market was WAY overvalued and it was prudent to take profits (btw I thought we would have a sudden crash, not a 3 year train wreck).  And back then mmkt's were paying over 6% and you could get around 5% muni's. Many clients were very grateful; still after a year or so, many said they didn't feel they should be paying a fee to be in mostly cash or s/t bonds.  Regardless of how I tried to convince them that I was doing what I thought was in their best interest and deserved to be paid for it, it pretty much fell on deaf ears.  It significantly impacted my production (for the negative).
Clients will resent seeing fees in down markets.  While you can still manage to salvage many of them, some will leave.  In recent years, I have placed a lot of $ in C shares, where we get paid decently and no fee is seen by the client.  And yes, I disclose to them the annual fees associated with the investment. And ironically, these are my best performing accounts (vs outside managers, mf wrap accounts, etc).
This business is, has been, and will continue to be an asset-gathering business.  That is what you can control.  Regardless of how good your performance is, the number of reviews/meetings you have with the client, etc you will still have some attrition. Keep bringing it in.

Please or Register to post comments.

Industry Newsletters
Careers Category Sponsor Links

Sponsored Introduction Continue on to (or wait seconds) ×