B/D vs Insurance

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Otane's picture
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Seeing how some insurance comapnies are offering alot of the same financial products as B/D, why would anyone want to work for a B/D's with payouts roughly 50% of insurance companies? 

Weddle Me's picture
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Edward Jones has been ranked one of the top places to work for years on end.  Why would anyone not want to work at one of the best companies in the world?
 
EDJ#1 

DCnew's picture
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Otane wrote:
Seeing how some insurance comapnies are offering alot of the same financial products as B/D, why would anyone want to work for a B/D's with payouts roughly 50% of insurance companies? 
Good question,
while I personally havent looked into the insurance route for B/D services, I have read on several posts how the payouts are CONSIDERABLY higher on the investment side. Can anyone on here who has experienced both sides expound on this point and give an objective comparision?
Thanks,
DC

deekay's picture
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The payouts can be considerably higher for investments and insurance sales don't have to go through a grid.  There isn't a product out there that I can't offer through my B/D (except for EIAs).  The downside is, if you're a rookie, you won't get the fat salary a wire will offer.  Plus you will have to pay for some (or all) office expenses. 

 
There Is No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.

BerkshireBull's picture
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At my insurance B/D.
 
Wrap payouts are 80% for everyone
 
Load funds and VA upfront are a sliding scale between 50-85%  I'd say the avg for someone hitting minimum goals is about 60%.  Once you hit $12mil in trailing AUM you get 70% minimum up to 85% if you're just crushing it.
 
12b-1 are:
 
0-$3mil trailing 20%
 
$3mil-6mil trailing 35%
 
$6mil-10mil trailing 55%
 
$10mil-12mil trailing 70%
 
$12mil+ trailing 85%
 
Things you pay:
 
$150/mo for office rent & supplies
$50/mo for E&O
$12/mo for voicemail
- You pay your postage, long distance, ticket charges if you do things through a brokerage account instead of direct
 
$300/ann "agent licensing"
+$400/ann for Reg Reps
+$400/ann for IAR's
 
The company reimburses $200/mo as an "agent allowence" if you're hitting their minimum goals.
 

Otane's picture
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deekay wrote:The payouts can be considerably higher for investments and insurance sales don't have to go through a grid.  There isn't a product out there that I can't offer through my B/D (except for EIAs).  The downside is, if you're a rookie, you won't get the fat salary a wire will offer.  Plus you will have to pay for some (or all) office expenses. 

 
There Is No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.
 
That is the Catch 22 of the financial service business. It almost seems that you are working for the Mafia.  It is easier, I think, during these times to sell someone insurance and annuities than managed funds. I am currently with a B/D, and alot of the advisors are barely scraping by - well educated and been in the biz for 5-10 years. That is not a good sign. 

Leverage's picture
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BerkshireBull wrote:
At my insurance B/D.
 
Wrap payouts are 80% for everyone
 
Load funds and VA upfront are a sliding scale between 50-85%  I'd say the avg for someone hitting minimum goals is about 60%.  Once you hit $12mil in trailing AUM you get 70% minimum up to 85% if you're just crushing it.
 
12b-1 are:
 
0-$3mil trailing 20%
 
$3mil-6mil trailing 35%
 
$6mil-10mil trailing 55%
 
$10mil-12mil trailing 70%
 
$12mil+ trailing 85%
 
Things you pay:
 
$150/mo for office rent & supplies
$50/mo for E&O
$12/mo for voicemail
- You pay your postage, long distance, ticket charges if you do things through a brokerage account instead of direct
 
$300/ann "agent licensing"
+$400/ann for Reg Reps
+$400/ann for IAR's
 
The company reimburses $200/mo as an "agent allowence" if you're hitting their minimum goals.
 
 
BB, I'm sure that you won't say but I'd like to know what company you are with.  It's certainly not my current/soon to be former mutual company. 
 
First of all, under 4 year agents are not allowed to do wrap accounts...even so, most don't have a 7 anyway. Load funds and VA, the grid starts at 35% for everyone and goes to 85%.  However, again under 4 year agents are strongly discouraged from selling anything but insurance anyway so it doesn't really matter. 
 
The standard fees apply for registered reps and agent licensing.  We've only got 2 IAR's in the entire office so...and E & O insuance is $30 twice monthly, copies and faxes are 9 cents per and there's free rent for the under 4 crowd.  However, once you hit the five year mark the rent starts at $600/mth and goes up depending on the size of your office/etc.
 
A small allowance is avaliable for assistants which amounts to about 4% of your gross commisions (I know because I had one...emphasis on HAD), the remainder of their salary comes out of your (the agents) pocket.  The company strongly encourages that you obtain an assistant within your first 12 - 18 months, it shows a level of dedication.
 
Of course the agent pays postage, long distance, etc.  They nickle and dime you to death. 
 
To the thread starter: The one thing to remember about insurance companies is just that...they are just that...insurance companies.  Most have no interests in agents selling equities period.  Most are masquerading as full service financial planning outfits when premium dollars are all that matters. 
 
Peace

Leverage's picture
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Otane wrote:deekay wrote:The payouts can be considerably higher for investments and insurance sales don't have to go through a grid.  There isn't a product out there that I can't offer through my B/D (except for EIAs).  The downside is, if you're a rookie, you won't get the fat salary a wire will offer.  Plus you will have to pay for some (or all) office expenses. 

 
There Is No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.
 
That is the Catch 22 of the financial service business. It almost seems that you are working for the Mafia.  It is easier, I think, during these times to sell someone insurance and annuities than managed funds. I am currently with a B/D, and alot of the advisors are barely scraping by - well educated and been in the biz for 5-10 years. That is not a good sign. 
 
Not necessarily the case.  Folks rarely and I mean RARELY want to talk about risk management (insurance).  Out of the 100 things a person has to do in their day, talking to their insurance agent is number 101.  However, at least talking about investments has the appearance of being sexier.  Folks always want to talk about the market...good or bad.  That's one of the main reasons that so many of the big insurance companies are masquerading as financial planning firms...because they know that NO one wants to talk insurance and the only way to get through the door is to pretend that they can do a complete financial needs analysis when the only thing really important is GETTING THOSE PREMIUM DOLLARS in the door. 
 
Then, in a lot of instances when you take the time and effort of presenting a well put together personal needs analysis and uncover a severe shortage in the individuals risk management, they chose to take the inexpensive route of all term insurance.  A million bucks of term insurance on a healthy 35 year old amounts to just enough in commissions to treat you and your spouse to a decent meal at a moderately priced eatery.
 
And if you should sell that expensive whole life policy that the company prefers that you sell...thing about this.  Throw in the fact that folks are losing their jobs left and right in this market...trying to cut back and the first thing to go is you guessed it, that expensive whole life insurance premium.  If the client hasn't suffered out the payments for 13 months, get ready for a "rollback" in your commissions.  There's nothing more fun than getting a negative commission statement.
 
So before you think that insurane is an easier sell, think about all the obstacles involved.
 
Peace

BerkshireBull's picture
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What the Jones/wirehouse guys don't understand is that at insurance companies a lot of the decisions are made at the agency level.  Of course insurance companies want agents/advisors to write insurance, but they will let you do all the other things because they know they need to be competitive to attract top talent and retain those that have taken their practices to true financial planning.Leverage:  I know Northwestern Mutual has equally high payouts on their investment products as we do.  I'd guess most insurance B/D offer a higher payout and to get the highest payouts you need to be doing a decent level of insurance business.  Our insurance production factors into our investment payout.icecold:  We don't do any of those things you listed, the day is coming when we will be able to, but it's not here yet.  The majority of our clients don't need and probably wouldn't want to do those things.  I don't think we'd want to do many of those in client accounts.  I write covered calls in my Ameritrade Account and have speculated on futures with a little bit of money but I'd never do it in a client's.  I have to believe they'd only lead to diffusion, lower production, unhappy clients, and an unhappy advisor.

LeaseNoMore's picture
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I'm an "old" guy making an unexpected career change since my current industry has died because of the credit crunch. 
 
I did the homework and have boiled it down to a mutual ins co., a wire house, and that place that makes you knock on doors.  My prefernce is to sell investments, not whole life policies... but the ins co says "no prob, you can do that here!"
 
They may say that, but all benchmarks for production, bonuses, and even the requirement to get your first paycheck, are based on sales of LIFE INSURANCE (first year premiums).
 
I am very much a rookie, but I have pretty much ruled out the ins co.  My impression is that they know most people don't really want to sell insurance, so they bait us with the sexier, more desirable prospect of being an investment guy too. 
 
Anybody agree?  Disagree?
 
Now my dilema is which way to go between the other two, which can be boiled down to this... would it be easier to find 5 customers with 100k to invest, or 1 customer with 500k to invest?

anonymous's picture
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There is no question that if you go with a life insurance company, you will be expected to sell life insurance.
 
For some people, it is easier to find 5 customers with $100K and for others, it would be easier to find 1 with 500K to invest.
 
If you are looking for easier, you may not want to give up on the life insurance company so quickly.  The insurance company's focus may be on investments, but yours doesn't have to be.  The key is simply that you'll have to do a minimum amount of insurance business. 
 
If you'd like, go ahead and focus on people with $500,000 or $100,000 to invest.  The difference is that if you run across someone who doesn't have a lump sum to invest, but has the cash flow to put away a decent chunk on a monthly basis, you may walk away with a sale that puts $5,000 into your pocket from someone that would otherwise be considered a non-prospect.
 
Personally, I don't have any desire to be an insurance salesman or an investment salesman.  I want to be a person who helps people achieve their financial goals while making a nice living doing it.  I'll sell what ever products (or advice) will allow both of these things to happen.

LeaseNoMore's picture
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Thanks Anonymous... good input.
 
Perhaps "easier" was a poor choice of words.  The real question was... While exerting the same amount of effort, is it more likely to grab five 100k people or one 500k?  I know there is no real answer... it's just newbie uncertainty, over-analyzing, etc.
 
I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Within that structure, I think I'd prefer to be an investment guy who can sell insurance, rather than an insurance guy who can sell investments.

anonymous's picture
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I look at it differently.  I'm neither an investment guy who can sell insurance nor an insurance guy who sells investments.  I'm a business owner who earns his living helping people achieve their goals. 
 
However, I absolutely do think of myself as a salesman.  I just don't care if I'm selling advice, selling insurance, sell investments, or some combination of the three. 
 
Sometimes in talking to prospects, I will explain that I'm a financial planner who thinks that financial plans are a waste.  The true value is in financial plan implementation. 
 
Our true value is in getting people to take the necessary actions. 
 
 

ChrisVarick's picture
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I work at a mutual insurance company. My personal experience has been that it is MUCH easier to find someone that can cut you $500/month premium versus finding someone who has $500k in ready to invest assets. This is not even consider selling these $500k prospects. A lot of the business owners that have cut me $1k-$2k/month premiums have a big insurance need, but at the end of the day they want to invest in their own business versus someone else's business. They don't care about 10-20% returns when they can get 1000% returns from their business. This is not to say the insurance route is better than a wirehouse route or vice versa, but I'm in it for the financial planning process as well, it's just that I need to ensure m survival first.

In terms of the investment payout at an insurance company, I'd say the numbers on this post has been fairly accurate. In the end, it's YOUR business so do whatever you want with it as long as you meet your contract minimums. I sell other insurance companies, non-proprietary funds, etc.
Icecold: You are correct, we are not able to sell any of the above mentioned products you have mentioned.

BerkshireBull's picture
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LeaseNoMore wrote:I'm an "old" guy making an unexpected career change since my current industry has died because of the credit crunch. 
 
I did the homework and have boiled it down to a mutual ins co., a wire house, and that place that makes you knock on doors.  My prefernce is to sell investments, not whole life policies... but the ins co says "no prob, you can do that here!"
 
They may say that, but all benchmarks for production, bonuses, and even the requirement to get your first paycheck, are based on sales of LIFE INSURANCE (first year premiums).
 
I am very much a rookie, but I have pretty much ruled out the ins co.  My impression is that they know most people don't really want to sell insurance, so they bait us with the sexier, more desirable prospect of being an investment guy too. 
 
Anybody agree?  Disagree?
 
Now my dilema is which way to go between the other two, which can be boiled down to this... would it be easier to find 5 customers with 100k to invest, or 1 customer with 500k to invest?Why are you anti life insurance?

deekay's picture
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BerkshireBull wrote: Why are you anti life insurance?
 

 
It's not sexy and it won't get you on the cover of 'Financial Advisor Monthly'.

BerkshireBull's picture
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deekay wrote:BerkshireBull wrote: Why are you anti life insurance?
 

 
It's not sexy and it won't get you on the cover of 'Financial Advisor Monthly'.True.I'm sick of newbies who have yet to open an account of any type thinking they're in a position to be flashy and run the type of practice that gets you magazine covers.

ChrisVarick's picture
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Ever see the movie Groundhog Day? That's a typical life insurance salesman.

Gordon Ramsey's picture
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ChrisVarick wrote:Ever see the movie Groundhog Day? That's a typical life insurance salesman.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xwCy_ai_E0I don't think Phil would be an expert in any kind of advanced underwriting.

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LeaseNoMore wrote:....I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Within that structure, I think I'd prefer to be an investment guy who can sell insurance, rather than an insurance guy who can sell investments.Everyone who joins this industry wants to consult...and if you have the cash reserves to cover a few years, you can do it. But if you want to get out of the gate and make $75k-$100k your first year...you have to sell!!!

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LeaseNoMore wrote: 
I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Then you're in the wrong business buddy.  This business is about selling, no matter what your title is.  We have to get people to act on the advice which helps them and put money in our pocket.  The annoying "Fee Only" crowd like NAPFA and Garrett Network love to spout out "We don't sell", which is horse crap.  They sell their services but they have the holier than thou mentality, which drives me crazy.   I don't know why people have such a hangup about being salesmen.  Sales people are the most important people in the world; if it wasn't for us, people wouldn't buy products and that's what makes the economy work.  Doctors and lawyers sell too.  Everytime I take my pet to the Vet, they're always trying to upsell me on something else I need.  What's wrong with selling life insurance? Life insurance actually helps families of all classes unlike an alternative investment/hedge fund investment.  Plus, just think about the probabilities.  This business is a numbers game.  With selling insurance, if you can get someone to give you a $100/month, you're getting paid close to $1K for that one sale versus a $100/month into Class A share.  You'll find a lot more people able to do $100/month for life insurance versus $500K investments.  Plus selling life insurance opens up the doors for other opportunities. 

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Still@jones wrote: LeaseNoMore wrote:....I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Within that structure, I think I'd prefer to be an investment guy who can sell insurance, rather than an insurance guy who can sell investments.Everyone who joins this industry wants to consult...and if you have the cash reserves to cover a few years, you can do it. But if you want to get out of the gate and make $75k-$100k your first year...you have to sell!!!

Still@jones, you need to rethink this.   This is a sales career and it always will be.

Still@jones's picture
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anonymous wrote:Still@jones wrote: LeaseNoMore wrote:....I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Within that structure, I think I'd prefer to be an investment guy who can sell insurance, rather than an insurance guy who can sell investments.Everyone who joins this industry wants to consult...and if you have the cash reserves to cover a few years, you can do it. But if you want to get out of the gate and make $75k-$100k your first year...you have to sell!!!

Still@jones, you need to rethink this.   This is a sales career and it always will be.....rethinking.....yeah, you are right! This is a sales job and nothing else...

LeaseNoMore's picture
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Ok...  let's compromise and say that using consultative selling techniques is the way to go.  Now, back to Football Night in America.

BerkshireBull's picture
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army13A wrote: LeaseNoMore wrote:
 
I, like you, want to consult... not sell.  Then you're in the wrong business buddy.  This business is about selling, no matter what your title is.  We have to get people to act on the advice which helps them and put money in our pocket.  The annoying "Fee Only" crowd like NAPFA and Garrett Network love to spout out "We don't sell", which is horse crap.  They sell their services but they have the holier than thou mentality, which drives me crazy.   I don't know why people have such a hangup about being salesmen.  Sales people are the most important people in the world; if it wasn't for us, people wouldn't buy products and that's what makes the economy work.  Doctors and lawyers sell too.  Everytime I take my pet to the Vet, they're always trying to upsell me on something else I need.  What's wrong with selling life insurance? Life insurance actually helps families of all classes unlike an alternative investment/hedge fund investment.  Plus, just think about the probabilities.  This business is a numbers game.  With selling insurance, if you can get someone to give you a $100/month, you're getting paid close to $1K for that one sale versus a $100/month into Class A share.  You'll find a lot more people able to do $100/month for life insurance versus $500K investments.  Plus selling life insurance opens up the doors for other opportunities. 

 
Yea but you're still unprofessional.  A real professional would spend his time pisspounding some small business owner into putting $50,000 in a muni-bond or a non-traded REIT.  He would be the 3rd such professional that week to attempt to do so.

gettingstarted's picture
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How is MassMutual's B/D?  I've heard the one at Guardian (PAS) is not good at all and I'm considering the two companies.  I've also applied at a more investment focused company with the following payouts listed on their site - how do they compare?The pay grid at xyz company is among the best in the industry.
Our graduated grid tops out at a 50% payout.  Additionally, Financial
Advisors are eligible for annual production bonuses of between 2% and
5% based upon yearly production.
We have worked side-by-side with our Financial Consultant community
to provide them with the ultimate control as to how they approach their
business by developing frameworks that can be tailored to fit the ways
in which individuals and teams work best. Qualified teams go through
the grid one time under our “Preferred Partners” or “Net Split”
programs.

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The simplified answer to the question is that Insurance Companies will have higher payouts for their products because once you leave, your book stays. Whereas, most wirehouses will allow your clients to move with you.

After coming from the Proprietary Insurance side and segwaying to the Independent Channel, I can see the difference. It's really not about the payout. It's about what clientelle do you want to work with.

On the captive agency of an insurance company, your target market is undereducated investors. You can make a good living working on accounts that range from $0 to $500,000. Every once in a great while, you will land a $700,000 account. But you won't ever deal with High Net Worths.

Going the wirehouse route, your range is a lot larger. Investors are more apt to invest with wirehouses when you are dealing with larger accounts. However, payouts are generally lower.

However, the driving factor is how long you want to be in the business. After you build a nice book and want more opportunity, wirehouses are easier to transition into the independent sector. Whereas, captive agencies will have you sign contracts and it is difficult to move clients and possible litigation will be brought against you.

Unfortunately, the Ed Jones Koolaid drinker that made his post is correct. They are a great place to start and build their career. However, you will work HARD! I'm not with EJ, but if I had to start my career path again, I would have started with them.

BerkshireBull's picture
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JohnJacobJingle wrote:The simplified answer to the question is that Insurance Companies will have higher payouts for their products because once you leave, your book stays. Whereas, most wirehouses will allow your clients to move with you.

After coming from the Proprietary Insurance side and segwaying to the Independent Channel, I can see the difference. It's really not about the payout. It's about what clientelle do you want to work with.

On the captive agency of an insurance company, your target market is undereducated investors. You can make a good living working on accounts that range from $0 to $500,000. Every once in a great while, you will land a $700,000 account. But you won't ever deal with High Net Worths.

Going the wirehouse route, your range is a lot larger. Investors are more apt to invest with wirehouses when you are dealing with larger accounts. However, payouts are generally lower.

However, the driving factor is how long you want to be in the business. After you build a nice book and want more opportunity, wirehouses are easier to transition into the independent sector. Whereas, captive agencies will have you sign contracts and it is difficult to move clients and possible litigation will be brought against you.

Unfortunately, the Ed Jones Koolaid drinker that made his post is correct. They are a great place to start and build their career. However, you will work HARD! I'm not with EJ, but if I had to start my career path again, I would have started with them.This post couldn't be more wrong.  A lot of insurance B/D will let you switch B/D and will not come after your investment clients as long as you keep an insurance producer contract with them.Wirehouses are coming loaded for bear the second you think about leaving them.You believe it's  easier to become self-employed from being a wirehouse employee than it is from being an insurance 1099 independent contractor?Also you can keep your insurance renewals at most places if you switch from a career agent contract to a producer or broker contract.

gettingstarted's picture
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True on the B/D switch, I've checked.  Also correct on the contract.  I have interviewed with one career mutual and you don't vest for many many years... Another you vest quickly, in 2-3 years so you don't lose your book.  I'm just weighing the pros and cons of both...

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JohnJacobJingle wrote:The simplified answer to the question is that Insurance Companies will have higher payouts for their products because once you leave, your book stays. Whereas, most wirehouses will allow your clients to move with you. After coming from the Proprietary Insurance side and segwaying to the Independent Channel, I can see the difference. It's really not about the payout. It's about what clientelle do you want to work with. On the captive agency of an insurance company, your target market is undereducated investors. You can make a good living working on accounts that range from $0 to $500,000. Every once in a great while, you will land a $700,000 account. But you won't ever deal with High Net Worths. Going the wirehouse route, your range is a lot larger. Investors are more apt to invest with wirehouses when you are dealing with larger accounts. However, payouts are generally lower. However, the driving factor is how long you want to be in the business. After you build a nice book and want more opportunity, wirehouses are easier to transition into the independent sector. Whereas, captive agencies will have you sign contracts and it is difficult to move clients and possible litigation will be brought against you. Unfortunately, the Ed Jones Koolaid drinker that made his post is correct. They are a great place to start and build their career. However, you will work HARD! I'm not with EJ, but if I had to start my career path again, I would have started with them.

 
JJJ, don't post without knowledge.  It's a waste of your time and the readers' time.

CFP83's picture
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Leverage wrote:
 
BB, I'm sure that you won't say but I'd like to know what company you are with.  It's certainly not my current/soon to be former mutual company. 
 
First of all, under 4 year agents are not allowed to do wrap accounts...even so, most don't have a 7 anyway. Load funds and VA, the grid starts at 35% for everyone and goes to 85%.  However, again under 4 year agents are strongly discouraged from selling anything but insurance anyway so it doesn't really matter. 
 
The standard fees apply for registered reps and agent licensing.  We've only got 2 IAR's in the entire office so...and E & O insuance is $30 twice monthly, copies and faxes are 9 cents per and there's free rent for the under 4 crowd.  However, once you hit the five year mark the rent starts at $600/mth and goes up depending on the size of your office/etc.
 
A small allowance is avaliable for assistants which amounts to about 4% of your gross commisions (I know because I had one...emphasis on HAD), the remainder of their salary comes out of your (the agents) pocket.  The company strongly encourages that you obtain an assistant within your first 12 - 18 months, it shows a level of dedication.
 
Of course the agent pays postage, long distance, etc.  They nickle and dime you to death. 
 
To the thread starter: The one thing to remember about insurance companies is just that...they are just that...insurance companies.  Most have no interests in agents selling equities period.  Most are masquerading as full service financial planning outfits when premium dollars are all that matters. 
 
Peace

Leverage, your going to leave "mother mutual"? Trust me, I know exactly what your describing because I recently left myself this year after 6 years.
 
I did the internship straight out of college and have went headfirst and full-bore ever since.  It's a funny effect that damn blue Kool-aid has on you....at least for me, I justified all of the bs and nickle and diming for years as "yeah I could make more money elsewhere, but I'd rather make less money and have access to the worlds best risk management products".
 
Let me just tell you this, not even 10 months into going independent I am seeing just how much money I was making for management, who couldn't sell or were just too lazy to.
I did an EXTENSIVE b/d search and I actually ended up going with one owned by a mutual insurance company that I do a good deal of life business with.  This seems hard to believe after coming out of "mother mutual", but I do business with this mutual insurance company as an independent advisor AND they give me access to their b/d.  Best part is I don't have to be my own OSJ and I'm getting 84% payout.
 
Leverage, feel free to send me a private message or reply to this post and I would share with you some of my thoughts having already gone through what you are about to and leaving the same company.

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CFP83 wrote:Leverage wrote:
 
BB, I'm sure that you won't say but I'd like to know what company you are with.  It's certainly not my current/soon to be former mutual company. 
 
First of all, under 4 year agents are not allowed to do wrap accounts...even so, most don't have a 7 anyway. Load funds and VA, the grid starts at 35% for everyone and goes to 85%.  However, again under 4 year agents are strongly discouraged from selling anything but insurance anyway so it doesn't really matter. 
 
The standard fees apply for registered reps and agent licensing.  We've only got 2 IAR's in the entire office so...and E & O insuance is $30 twice monthly, copies and faxes are 9 cents per and there's free rent for the under 4 crowd.  However, once you hit the five year mark the rent starts at $600/mth and goes up depending on the size of your office/etc.
 
A small allowance is avaliable for assistants which amounts to about 4% of your gross commisions (I know because I had one...emphasis on HAD), the remainder of their salary comes out of your (the agents) pocket.  The company strongly encourages that you obtain an assistant within your first 12 - 18 months, it shows a level of dedication.
 
Of course the agent pays postage, long distance, etc.  They nickle and dime you to death. 
 
To the thread starter: The one thing to remember about insurance companies is just that...they are just that...insurance companies.  Most have no interests in agents selling equities period.  Most are masquerading as full service financial planning outfits when premium dollars are all that matters. 
 
Peace

Leverage, your going to leave "mother mutual"? Trust me, I know exactly what your describing because I recently left myself this year after 6 years.
 
I did the internship straight out of college and have went headfirst and full-bore ever since.  It's a funny effect that damn blue Kool-aid has on you....at least for me, I justified all of the bs and nickle and diming for years as "yeah I could make more money elsewhere, but I'd rather make less money and have access to the worlds best risk management products".
 
Let me just tell you this, not even 10 months into going independent I am seeing just how much money I was making for management, who couldn't sell or were just too lazy to.
I did an EXTENSIVE b/d search and I actually ended up going with one owned by a mutual insurance company that I do a good deal of life business with.  This seems hard to believe after coming out of "mother mutual", but I do business with this mutual insurance company as an independent advisor AND they give me access to their b/d.  Best part is I don't have to be my own OSJ and I'm getting 84% payout.
 
Leverage, feel free to send me a private message or reply to this post and I would share with you some of my thoughts having already gone through what you are about to and leaving the same company.Welcome to the board and good information.  I know my Mutual Ins Co will allow independents with a clean U4 join our B/D as long as they put a minimal amount of insurance business through like as little as $6k FYC I think.I'm sure there are companies with better platforms and payouts than ours, but we're pretty competitive and I'm happy for now!

CFP83's picture
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Joined: 2009-11-14

Thanks for the welcome BB.....I actually just found this forum last night.  I'm kinda new to the whole "forum" thing.  Earlier this year though I came across www.insurance-forums.net , which, for the advisors who do life/di/ltc is also a excellent discussion board.  So just yesterday I started searching for a similiar boards that had more of an investment focus....this one seems to be great and has some excellent discussions

aeromaks's picture
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Joined: 2007-01-13

BerkshireBull wrote:
CFP83 wrote:Leverage wrote:
 
BB, I'm sure that you won't say but I'd like to know what company you are with.  It's certainly not my current/soon to be former mutual company. 
 
First of all, under 4 year agents are not allowed to do wrap accounts...even so, most don't have a 7 anyway. Load funds and VA, the grid starts at 35% for everyone and goes to 85%.  However, again under 4 year agents are strongly discouraged from selling anything but insurance anyway so it doesn't really matter. 
 
The standard fees apply for registered reps and agent licensing.  We've only got 2 IAR's in the entire office so...and E & O insuance is $30 twice monthly, copies and faxes are 9 cents per and there's free rent for the under 4 crowd.  However, once you hit the five year mark the rent starts at $600/mth and goes up depending on the size of your office/etc.
 
A small allowance is avaliable for assistants which amounts to about 4% of your gross commisions (I know because I had one...emphasis on HAD), the remainder of their salary comes out of your (the agents) pocket.  The company strongly encourages that you obtain an assistant within your first 12 - 18 months, it shows a level of dedication.
 
Of course the agent pays postage, long distance, etc.  They nickle and dime you to death. 
 
To the thread starter: The one thing to remember about insurance companies is just that...they are just that...insurance companies.  Most have no interests in agents selling equities period.  Most are masquerading as full service financial planning outfits when premium dollars are all that matters. 
 
Peace

Leverage, your going to leave "mother mutual"? Trust me, I know exactly what your describing because I recently left myself this year after 6 years.
 
I did the internship straight out of college and have went headfirst and full-bore ever since.  It's a funny effect that damn blue Kool-aid has on you....at least for me, I justified all of the bs and nickle and diming for years as "yeah I could make more money elsewhere, but I'd rather make less money and have access to the worlds best risk management products".
 
Let me just tell you this, not even 10 months into going independent I am seeing just how much money I was making for management, who couldn't sell or were just too lazy to.
I did an EXTENSIVE b/d search and I actually ended up going with one owned by a mutual insurance company that I do a good deal of life business with.  This seems hard to believe after coming out of "mother mutual", but I do business with this mutual insurance company as an independent advisor AND they give me access to their b/d.  Best part is I don't have to be my own OSJ and I'm getting 84% payout.
 
Leverage, feel free to send me a private message or reply to this post and I would share with you some of my thoughts having already gone through what you are about to and leaving the same company.Welcome to the board and good information.  I know my Mutual Ins Co will allow independents with a clean U4 join our B/D as long as they put a minimal amount of insurance business through like as little as $6k FYC I think.I'm sure there are companies with better platforms and payouts than ours, but we're pretty competitive and I'm happy for now!if its any place like where I was for a few weeks, that BD is not much. =P  No matter what, any insurance company will want you to focus on insurance.  This would be like joining a wirehouse to be an insurance producer.

WiAdvisor's picture
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Joined: 2007-05-03

gettingstarted wrote:How is MassMutual's B/D?  I've heard the one at Guardian (PAS) is not good at all and I'm considering the two companies.  I've also applied at a more investment focused company with the following payouts listed on their site - how do they compare?
The pay grid at xyz company is among the best in the industry. Our graduated grid tops out at a 50% payout.  Additionally, Financial Advisors are eligible for annual production bonuses of between 2% and 5% based upon yearly production.
We have worked side-by-side with our Financial Consultant community to provide them with the ultimate control as to how they approach their business by developing frameworks that can be tailored to fit the ways in which individuals and teams work best. Qualified teams go through the grid one time under our “Preferred Partners” or “Net Split” programs.
 
MassMutual's BD is really good, what did you want to know?

BerkshireBull's picture
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Joined: 2009-06-10

CFP83 wrote:Thanks for the welcome BB.....I actually just found this forum last night.  I'm kinda new to the whole "forum" thing.  Earlier this year though I came across www.insurance-forums.net , which, for the advisors who do life/di/ltc is also a excellent discussion board.  So just yesterday I started searching for a similiar boards that had more of an investment focus....this one seems to be great and has some excellent discussionsI've read a little on that board.  Most (not all) of the members are pretty basic insurance agents and tend to have a product or two they focus on.  I have seen some really nice prospecting ideas thrown around over there in the past.This place on the other hand seems to attract (not always) people doing financial planning and the discussion tends to (not always) be more sophisticated.  What this place DOES HAVE is has more drama and entertainment value than any other forum for people in our business.

Sportsfreakbob's picture
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Joined: 2008-08-24

Bull, that was the most well put, politically correct, description of the character of this forum that i could have ever imagined.
Well done.

CFP83's picture
Offline
Joined: 2009-11-14

BerkshireBull wrote: CFP83 wrote:Thanks for the welcome BB.....I actually just found this forum last night.  I'm kinda new to the whole "forum" thing.  Earlier this year though I came across www.insurance-forums.net , which, for the advisors who do life/di/ltc is also a excellent discussion board.  So just yesterday I started searching for a similiar boards that had more of an investment focus....this one seems to be great and has some excellent discussionsI've read a little on that board.  Most (not all) of the members are pretty basic insurance agents and tend to have a product or two they focus on.  I have seen some really nice prospecting ideas thrown around over there in the past.This place on the other hand seems to attract (not always) people doing financial planning and the discussion tends to (not always) be more sophisticated.  What this place DOES HAVE is has more drama and entertainment value than any other forum for people in our business.

I'm looking forward to interacting with all of you on this forum and really glad I found it.  BB your pretty much right about insurance-forums, it is a great forum with some good topics, but most are mainly insurance focused and in some cases product focused.

high net worth insurance's picture
Joined: 2011-07-07

A wire is really the way to go if you are looking to make money off of investments. You should concentrate on this field. Insurance just isn't cutting it these days.JohnIndependent Insurance Agents

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