question for the bank kids

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troll's picture
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If things are so great at the bank and you guys are making money, hand over fist, like you claim, why is it that banks can't recruit any heavy hitters? Why aren't the rest of us tripping over each other to get to the Nirvana that is being a bank broker? Are ALL of us stupid and unable to figure out that you guys are getting rich? How have ALL of us missed the boat?
Does anyone else wonder the same thing?

snaggletooth's picture
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I remember as I was leaving the wirehouse there was a team from somewhere in Cleveland that was recruited by BofA to basically cover a huge area in SoCal.  They were promised huge bonuses and had "access" to all of the clients at BofA in the area.  I guess that didn't really happen and they sued BofA for not keeping their promises and won in court.  Then after that, there were a few other cases of banks lying to their new brokers.  It doesn't sound too appealing to have your employer lie to you.  I know it doesn't happen across the board, and some very small banks may provide some great opportunities.  I would much rather OWN my business and MY clients.  For those who can't prospect, sometimes a bank is their only way to be in this business in my opinion.

BankFC's picture
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Bobby, you exaggerate and dramatize more than my ex-girlfriend.
I haven't seen a post that flat out says the bank channel is the best channel.  If there has been one, I'd tell them they are wrong.  There is no one best channel.
With that said, I really like the bank.  Whether you believe me or anyone else, you can (without too much effort) pull down big dollars in the bank channel...and keep a balanced life to boot. 
Indy has its benefits.  Wire has its benefits.  Bank has it's benefits.
Why are you so worried about it?
 

BankFC's picture
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snaggletooth wrote:I remember as I was leaving the wirehouse there was a team from somewhere in Cleveland that was recruited by BofA to basically cover a huge area in SoCal.  They were promised huge bonuses and had "access" to all of the clients at BofA in the area.  I guess that didn't really happen and they sued BofA for not keeping their promises and won in court.  Then after that, there were a few other cases of banks lying to their new brokers.  It doesn't sound too appealing to have your employer lie to you.  I know it doesn't happen across the board, and some very small banks may provide some great opportunities.  I would much rather OWN my business and MY clients.  For those who can't prospect, sometimes a bank is their only way to be in this business in my opinion.
That suit was well documented, but seriously, do you think a bank is any more apt to lie to a potential recruit than a wirehouse???

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BankFC wrote:
snaggletooth wrote:I remember as I was leaving the wirehouse there was a team from somewhere in Cleveland that was recruited by BofA to basically cover a huge area in SoCal.  They were promised huge bonuses and had "access" to all of the clients at BofA in the area.  I guess that didn't really happen and they sued BofA for not keeping their promises and won in court.  Then after that, there were a few other cases of banks lying to their new brokers.  It doesn't sound too appealing to have your employer lie to you.  I know it doesn't happen across the board, and some very small banks may provide some great opportunities.  I would much rather OWN my business and MY clients.  For those who can't prospect, sometimes a bank is their only way to be in this business in my opinion.
That suit was well documented, but seriously, do you think a bank is any more apt to lie to a potential recruit than a wirehouse???

I was never comparing banks to wirehouses.  Just thinking more in my own situation as an Indy.  I wouldn't ever want to be in the bank or wirehouse world anymore for reasons that Joe said in another post among many other reasons as well.  I'm much happier being an owner.  Anyone anywhere can be lied to, it doesn't just happen at banks.

rightway's picture
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I work for a wire and have never been lied to.  Maybe I have been
lucky, but they have been very good to my clients and me.  I used
to work for a bank, and the story was very different there though, but
in retrospect they were bankers trying to run a brokerage and the
conflict was too great.

I left the bank and considered all options having wanted to work with
larger clients, families, and endowments...not 500 clients that had
$300k in IRA assets (if that were the case, Indy seems a good
choice).  

My model called for a firms support system and name.  It
worked.  I handle about 100 relationships, have a team that
handles all of the operations and most of the sales, and I have a
pretty nice life.  Management leaves me alone unless I ask for
assistance.  I guess I just don't see where all of the negativity
comes from with the wires...but maybe my experience is not the norm.

All in all, I found the bank a great place to start, learn the ropes,
and build some assets for myself...but it was not a place for me to
have a career run.

Oldproducer's picture
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I have a checking account at a bank. I was amused when their broker approached me to discuss investments. The poor fellow couldn't even maintain eye contact. His wife owns his ass.

troll's picture
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Oldproducer wrote:I have a checking account at a bank. I was amused when their broker approached me to discuss investments. The poor fellow couldn't even maintain eye contact. His wife owns his ass.
That happens to me all the time. Those kids crack me up. Their first names are sewn into their shirts.

troll's picture
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BankFC wrote:
Bobby, you exaggerate and dramatize more than my ex-girlfriend.
I haven't seen a post that flat out says the bank channel is the best channel.  If there has been one, I'd tell them they are wrong.  There is no one best channel.
With that said, I really like the bank.  Whether you believe me or anyone else, you can (without too much effort) pull down big dollars in the bank channel...and keep a balanced life to boot. 
Indy has its benefits.  Wire has its benefits.  Bank has it's benefits.
Why are you so worried about it?

I knew you'd try to weasel out of it, just like you weaseled out of prospecting. You think that the NET benefits of being a bank kid outweigh the net benefits of other channels. I understand. You HAVE to convince yourself of this to keep from weeping.

BankFC's picture
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So, I weaseled out of arguing a position I don't believe (the bank is the BEST channel, ala your first post)...sucks for you, I didn't take your bait.
 

troll's picture
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I have zero respect for bank brokers.  Anyone that gets business handed to them, and that includes kids that take over the books of their parents, never had to prospect and bust their ass.

troll's picture
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BankFC wrote:
So, I weaseled out of arguing a position I don't believe (the bank is the BEST channel, ala your first post)...sucks for you, I didn't take your bait.
 

I don't believe that the bank channel is the best, either. I think it's the worst.

troll's picture
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Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.

scrim67's picture
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Why can't everyone just agree that every situation is different and each one of us can find the best situation that meets are own needs?
If someone is a good advisor they should be a good advisor no matter what channel they are gainfully employed.
Can we atleast all agree?
scrim

troll's picture
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Bobby Hull wrote:BankFC wrote:
So, I weaseled out of arguing a position I don't believe (the bank is the BEST channel, ala your first post)...sucks for you, I didn't take your bait.

I don't believe that the bank channel is the best, either. I think it's the worst.

The reality is that the bank channel is for those who could not get hired by a wirehouse, or who washed out at a wirehouse.
Those who were never given the chance will go to their graves wondering what might have been if they had what it takes, while those who washed out will go to their graves wondering what might have been if they had what it takes.

Ashland's picture
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Ferris Bueller wrote: Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.

Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!

troll's picture
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Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
Tell us Ashland, if the client needs the money within a year where do you put it?

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Devil'sAdvocate wrote: Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
Tell us Ashland, if the client needs the money within a year where do you put it?

Unless there's other opportunity I usually don't accept the account. I help people with longer term financial goals - 3 yrs or more. If I do an account of this nature it would likely be a mixture of mmkt & floaters.

troll's picture
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Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
I'm confident in his ability to make the relationship economically worthwhile.

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I once thought that the bank channel was an excellent place to work. Unfortunately, it turned out that it wasn't for me. Very few bankers have a clue how to run such a program If you work for a bank program that is well-ran, consider yourself very fortunate. Most bankers are stupid, greedy and jealous. The prez who hired me was none of those and I told him when I left that if he were my direct superior, I probably wouldn't have considered leaving. Instead, I was dealing with a couple of power-hungry idiots who's only contributions were interference which only slowed me down and hurt my production.

It was a happy day when I bailed that ship.

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Devil'sAdvocate wrote: Did Steve Prefontaine really say that, or are you just another lazy idiot who can't proofread your own drivel?

Devil - I found the quote here:

http://www.motivateus.com/rememb-2.htm

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Bobby Hull wrote: Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
I'm confident in his ability to make the relationship economically worthwhile.

Ferris, I see how it is. How many other siblings did Bobby & Pratoman's mother make? You can't be the only one. You are obviously his favorite, though. So that's something.

troll's picture
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Ashland wrote: Devil'sAdvocate wrote: Did Steve Prefontaine really say that, or are you just another lazy idiot who can't proofread your own drivel? Devil - I found the quote here: http://www.motivateus.com/rememb-2.htm[/quote]
What does the word proofread to you, moron?

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Devil'sAdvocate wrote: Ashland wrote: Devil'sAdvocate wrote: Did Steve Prefontaine really say that, or are you just another lazy idiot who can't proofread your own drivel? Devil - I found the quote here: http://www.motivateus.com/rememb-2.htm[/quote]
What does the word proofread to you, moron?

Yeah, I'm just another lazy idiot who can't proofread my own drivel. That's why I pay Bobby to write all the letters I send out. He's the only person I know who has that kind of time.

troll's picture
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Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
 
I did what is right for this woman.  That's why I manage 110+MM in assets.  How much do you manage, little boy?

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QUOTE]Well said and well done, Ferris.  It's idiots like Ashland applying that attitude that cause problems for all of us.  You have to do what is right by the client, even if in the short term is isn't so good for you.  Otherwise, how can we expect them to trust us?

Most of the time I find myself agreeing w/ you, Joe. In this case if you read the rest of the thread you would have found that I had said that I wouldn't have accepted the account & that if I had I would have used mmkt's & floaters. CD's aren't even the right thing for this client because she may find a place next week.

By the way - where is she living while she no longer owns a place, Ferris? Does it have a long or short-term lease? Will she use ALL of the money for the new place? Why did she move from the old place? If it was for health reasons, might it not be in her best interest to buy another place? Does she have elderly parents, kids or grandkids who may need her support? Where does she get her retirement income from? Is it a stable source? How is she creating payraises? How recently retired? Is she going to boomerang, or is she really done?

My attitude is fine, Joe. I look out for people. At the same time, I know my limitations in the channel that I am in. It's not in the best interest of the client, myself, or the bank for me to do something that is short term money.

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Ashland's picture
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Joe -

One of the big differences between working at a bank & a wirehouse is that most people I meet are already clients of the bank. I have, therefore, a much higher level of credibility than you with a new client from the word go.

One of the primary reasons I wouldn't accept this account(again, unless there is more - immediate - opportunity) is that a $400,000 deposit would mean more to a branch manager's P&L than it would to me. My best customer(the bank) appreciates when I help them grow their assets. In addition I do not lose any ability to follow up with the customer. So, I can create a win-win-win here. The customer wins because she gets into something that she's very comfortable with - mmkt & a short-term cd special which is darn close to what I'd be offering. The bank wins because they get a big addition to their deposit & I win because I did something for the client that the personal banker wouldn't have managed to put together.

So, if I was in your world, I would certainly take the account. In mine, it's not the best choice to.

Tormented Ulaf's picture
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And you spend all day posting on an internet forum.  Sad.
Ferris Bueller wrote:Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
 
I did what is right for this woman.  That's why I manage 110+MM in assets.  How much do you manage, little boy?

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Ashland wrote:Joe - One of the big differences between working at a bank & a wirehouse is that most people I meet are already clients of the bank. I have, therefore, a much higher level of credibility than you with a new client from the word go. One of the primary reasons I wouldn't accept this account(again, unless there is more - immediate - opportunity) is that a $400,000 deposit would mean more to a branch manager's P&L than it would to me. My best customer(the bank) appreciates when I help them grow their assets. In addition I do not lose any ability to follow up with the customer. So, I can create a win-win-win here. The customer wins because she gets into something that she's very comfortable with - mmkt & a short-term cd special which is darn close to what I'd be offering. The bank wins because they get a big addition to their deposit & I win because I did something for the client that the personal banker wouldn't have managed to put together. So, if I was in your world, I would certainly take the account. In mine, it's not the best choice to.
I used to do the same thing but then I realized the money markets I offered were higher than the bank money markets and there was no "six month teaser rate" involved.   I always look to do best for the client so instead of giving those back to the bank I open the accounts in almost all cases now.
scrim

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scrim67 wrote:I used to do the same thing but then I realized the money markets I offered were higher than the bank money markets and there was no "six month teaser rate" involved.   I always look to do best for the client so instead of giving those back to the bank I open the accounts in almost all cases now.
scrim
Bingo.  Client first.

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joedabrkr wrote:  I would presume that there is a reasonable chance that at some point in the next few years the bank will eff you sufficiently (lowered payout, too many meetings, splitting territories, etc) that you may want to leave.
...having been there and done that, I'd say there's a high likelihood of that.  The senior VP's will get pissed when you're making more coin than they are and they'll find a way to take some of it off the table.  Scrim, this goes for you too...they'll find a way to stick it to you and then you'll have all those proprietary fee-based accounts...

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Ashland wrote:Joe - One of the big differences between working at a bank & a wirehouse is that most people I meet are already clients of the bank. I have, therefore, a much higher level of credibility than you with a new client from the word go. One of the primary reasons I wouldn't accept this account(again, unless there is more - immediate - opportunity) is that a $400,000 deposit would mean more to a branch manager's P&L than it would to me. My best customer(the bank) appreciates when I help them grow their assets. In addition I do not lose any ability to follow up with the customer. So, I can create a win-win-win here. The customer wins because she gets into something that she's very comfortable with - mmkt & a short-term cd special which is darn close to what I'd be offering. The bank wins because they get a big addition to their deposit & I win because I did something for the client that the personal banker wouldn't have managed to put together. So, if I was in your world, I would certainly take the account. In mine, it's not the best choice to.
I hate my bank and everyone that works there. They are a bunch of f**king idiots. I'm too lazy to move my accounts and all banks suck, anyway.

Ashland's picture
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Bobby... here's how you can make the time... post here 4 times on Monday instead of 9... THERE YA GO!

troll's picture
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See my AUM below before you judge.  Who gives a $hit how much time I spend posting here if 1.  My clients are happy 2. I'm making way more than you. 3. My AUM keeps growing from referrals.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it, piker.
 
Tormented Ulaf wrote:
And you spend all day posting on an internet forum.  Sad.
Ferris Bueller wrote:Ashland wrote: Ferris Bueller wrote:
Had a referral in my office last week.  She just sold her house and is moving, so she has about 400K and is going to be looking over the next year for a new house.
So what did the greedy bank broker, whom she met right before me, suggest to this recently retired woman?  Stocks and mutual funds.  What a moron.
So we chuckled about the bank broker not being a real financial advisor as we opened the account.
Ferris, I'm assuming that Mrs. retiree bought brokerage cd's or the equivalent for her $400,000. Which you made about $60 net on... Good job & great account! All you have to do is cold call 5000 more people to get 1000 more of those customers & you'll be at your $150,000 in revenue for the year. Hey, at least your AUM will look good!
 
I did what is right for this woman.  That's why I manage 110+MM in assets.  How much do you manage, little boy?

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First of all, she's not in CD's.  Money Market is the best solution for her.  And I made sure I knew my facts before making that suggestion.  See below.
I took the account because you never know when that money market will turn into something larger or when she will refer someone to me.  Especially since I did the right thing for her.  Plus the bank lost out and I LOVE taking money away from them.  Especially some bank fc that wanted to put this woman's house money into stocks.
Ashland wrote:By the way - where is she living while she no longer owns a place, Ferris? Does it have a long or short-term lease? Moving to a new city, she doesn't know where she will live yet.  Will she use ALL of the money for the new place? Don't know yet.  Will know when she does. Why did she move from the old place? Retirement, moving to a new city. If it was for health reasons, might it not be in her best interest to buy another place? Does she have elderly parents, kids or grandkids who may need her support? Nope Where does she get her retirement income from? Is it a stable source? Very stable pension How is she creating payraises? COLA How recently retired? Last week Is she going to boomerang, or is she really done? Done working

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Ferris Bueller wrote: First of all, she's not in CD's.  Money Market is the best solution for her.  And I made sure I knew my facts before making that suggestion.  See below.
I took the account because you never know when that money market will turn into something larger or when she will refer someone to me.  Especially since I did the right thing for her.  Plus the bank lost out and I LOVE taking money away from them.  Especially some bank fc that wanted to put this woman's house money into stocks.
Ashland wrote:By the way - where is she living while she no longer owns a place, Ferris? Does it have a long or short-term lease? Moving to a new city, she doesn't know where she will live yet.  Will she use ALL of the money for the new place? Don't know yet.  Will know when she does. Why did she move from the old place? Retirement, moving to a new city. If it was for health reasons, might it not be in her best interest to buy another place? Does she have elderly parents, kids or grandkids who may need her support? Nope Where does she get her retirement income from? Is it a stable source? Very stable pension How is she creating payraises? COLA How recently retired? Last week Is she going to boomerang, or is she really done? Done working

She's moving... Are there people where she's moving to? The kind she can talk to in person, I mean?

Bobby must've been a cool dad growing up. You seem to have drunk a lot of kool-aid in your youth.

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Ferris - I'm being a real jerk, here, and I apologize for that. I think you did something really nice with this lady & probably saved her some sleepless nights and possibly a great deal of money.

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Can we get back on topic regarding how the bank brokers suck...

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Ferris Bueller wrote:Can we get back on topic regarding how the bank brokers suck...
If I was one, but saw the error of my ways and departed, do I still suck, but not as much??

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snaggletooth wrote:I remember as I was leaving the wirehouse there was a team from somewhere in Cleveland that was recruited by BofA to basically cover a huge area in SoCal.  They were promised huge bonuses and had "access" to all of the clients at BofA in the area.  I guess that didn't really happen and they sued BofA for not keeping their promises and won in court.  Then after that, there were a few other cases of banks lying to their new brokers.  It doesn't sound too appealing to have your employer lie to you.  I know it doesn't happen across the board, and some very small banks may provide some great opportunities.  I would much rather OWN my business and MY clients.  For those who can't prospect, sometimes a bank is their only way to be in this business in my opinion.
Blah blah blah where did these guys go back to the wirehouse...No they went to another bank.  They are smart.

dalbroker's picture
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Where's the love .........

the word's picture
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The jealousy runeth over in this thread. 
Ferris Wrote
"I have zero respect for bank brokers.  Anyone that gets business handed to them, and that includes kids that take over the books of their parents, never had to prospect and bust their ass."
That is not zero respect.  It is profound jealousy.  Your are jealous b/c i don't have to "bust my ass" to make money.  Good money!  Making money with the least possible effort sounds like a smart idea.  Im sure boardrooms are full of conversations on how to work harder for the same result.  Work smarter, not harder.

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the word wrote:
The jealousy runeth over in this thread. 
Ferris Wrote
"I have zero respect for bank brokers.  Anyone that gets business handed to them, and that includes kids that take over the books of their parents, never had to prospect and bust their ass."
That is not zero respect.  It is profound jealousy.  Your are jealous b/c i don't have to "bust my ass" to make money.  Good money!  Making money with the least possible effort sounds like a smart idea.  Im sure boardrooms are full of conversations on how to work harder for the same result.  Work smarter, not harder.

NONE of us outside the banks are jealous of you..........  Some of us worked in banks, but got "haircut" so much we decided to work somewhere else, make more money, and actually HAVE clients that we can call ours........

the word's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-16

To bad you had such a bad deal, I don't.  I work at a very small community bank, and my deal is very similar to your indy deal.  I come and go when i want and only answer to the CEO of the bank.  Can sell what i want and there are no prop products. 
I dont care about having clients that i can call my own.  I care about income.
I don't care that you may make more money giving financial advice.  This is just one source of income for me.  So this situation gives me time to manage my other income producing endeavors.
 
It is really like scrim said.  To each his own.  If you like your way great.  My way works for me.  And my choice to work in a bank in no way degrades the quality of financial advice i give.

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

I make more than you, work less, yet don't have it handed to me.  That's why I have zero respect for you.

the word's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-16

You may work less and make more now, but you had to "bust your ass" for it at some point, to get to the point where you are now. 
I am 27 and never have, nor never will have to bust my ass to get where you are.  I guess i can see why you would be jealous.
 

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