bank payout grids

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braves fan's picture
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Joined: 2006-07-06

Ok, so I know that everyone has their own opinions about banks vs. wirehouses vs. indy.  I'm just looking for factual data on bank payouts.
I'm currently looking at a bank position (it's a community bank with about 50 branches) that comes with a permanent salary of 33k.  However, on your commissions, you do not get paid anything until you hit $25,000 of GDC per quarter.  After this, you get between 35-45%.  Is this common in bank programs, for the first stop on the grid to be a 0% payout?

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

So you're getting 2,750 per month and then commish on prodo over 8.33M/month. That means you're getting a 33% payout for the first 8.3 and then 35% for over and above. Smith Barney guys would love a deal like that.
I guess it skews it in the bank's favor if they make you do the whole 25 in the first month (as in if you do 24,999 you get 2,750 and then start at only -$1 the next month. I'd question them on that point. It's just nickle and dimeish enough for it to be a bank "policy" it only marginally screws you for gross commish but screws with your cash flow big time four times a year.

noggin's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-30

Tell them to take a hike, refuse the salary and pay you 45% from dollar one.....

bankrep1's picture
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Joined: 2004-12-02

I think the % is irrelevant, what kind of volume of referrals will you be given?   Will they be quality or crap? Will bank mgmt. be held account for your referral/revenue goals. etc. If I give you 100% of 0 it is 0 if I give you 50% of $100,000 it's 50,000. Don't get hung up on the %

Indyone's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-30

As has been stated by others, with the salary, your first $100K in production is paying out at 33%.  What is more common is a draw against commission that starts out often below 33%.  The rest sounds pretty similar to what I recall.  On balance, for a bank, it sounds pretty good, particularly if you get good referral activity from other bank employees.

Ashland's picture
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Joined: 2007-03-06

Do you get to keep your trails? Many bank programs(especially comm bank models) give you salaries but then have you as an employee for life. You want to make sure you have:

1 - A breakout plan - can turn your $60 - $75K first year into a business that gives you over the next 5 years an increasing income based on past and current performance and you're not just tied to generating more commissions each and every year for the same salary.

2 - A breakaway plan - allows you to go Indy w/n the bank channel & get a higher payout if you get to that point.

Good luck!

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

It is a good payout structure.  Ours is similar, but is it based on a MONTHLY bogie ($10,000 gross) rather than a quarterly bogie ($25,000 gross in your example). 
Our payout structure is as follows:
$14,400 annual salary guaranteed
0% up to $9,999. 
30% on $10,000 to $19,999
32.5% on $20,000 to $29,999
35% on $30,000 to $39,999
37.5% on $40,000 to $49,999
40% on $50,000 and above
So as you can see, your payout grid is actually probably better than ours.  We also get a laptop, cell phone, expense account, 100% on health ins, (if single only), 6% 401K contribution, and they will cover seminars and such on a discretionary basis (although I personally don't do much in that area).
Bankrep is right, although how the quality of referrals will be is impossible to know. 
There are many things you might want to know going in.  Has there been a rep there in the past?  How old is there program?  What are their revenue expectations?  How many branches, and how much in deposit base?  Is there an incentive program in place for employees to refer business?
 

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:
It is a good payout structure.  Ours is similar, but is it based on a MONTHLY bogie ($10,000 gross) rather than a quarterly bogie ($25,000 gross in your example). 
Our payout structure is as follows:
$14,400 annual salary guaranteed
0% up to $9,999. 
30% on $10,000 to $19,999
32.5% on $20,000 to $29,999
35% on $30,000 to $39,999
37.5% on $40,000 to $49,999
40% on $50,000 and above
So as you can see, your payout grid is actually probably better than ours.  We also get a laptop, cell phone, expense account, 100% on health ins, (if single only), 6% 401K contribution, and they will cover seminars and such on a discretionary basis (although I personally don't do much in that area).
Bankrep is right, although how the quality of referrals will be is impossible to know. 
There are many things you might want to know going in.  Has there been a rep there in the past?  How old is there program?  What are their revenue expectations?  How many branches, and how much in deposit base?  Is there an incentive program in place for employees to refer business?
 

A guy doing 60,000 gets a 29.2% payout? A guy doing $30,000 gets paid 21%? Do you people suck at prospecting SO BAD that you will let yourself be pimped out at this rate? You bank kids don't REALLY wonder why normal people look down at you, do you?

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

Bobby, you're so worried about proving a point (that doesn't exist) you make yourself look so dumb...or maybe all those numbers on your solar calculator just get a little too confusing for you.
 
If I do $40,000, I get paid 37.5% on every dollar.  It isn't a graduated scale.

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:
Bobby, you're so worried about proving a point (that doesn't exist) you make yourself look so dumb...or maybe all those numbers on your solar calculator just get a little too confusing for you.
 
If I do $40,000, I get paid 37.5% on every dollar.  It isn't a graduated scale.

I thought it was a graduated scale because you presented it as a graduated scale.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

No I didn't.  I represented it as a MONTHLY scale.  I suppose the words MONTHLY in bold at the begginning of the post must've thrown you off.
 

NaySayer's picture
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Joined: 2006-05-10

Bobby Hull wrote:
Do you people suck at prospecting SO BAD that you will let yourself be pimped out at this rate?
Yes! Banks are a good option for brokers who aren't good at prospecting.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

Sylvan Learning Center is good for people who have a hard time with reading comprehension...Bobby, care for me to post the link for you?

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:
Sylvan Learning Center is good for people who have a hard time with reading comprehension...Bobby, care for me to post the link for you?

Why don't you look at your post and look at my response? You will see that YOU are the one lacking in comprehension. You have been proven to be an idiot or a liar. Your monthly grid is graduated and not retroactive, as you have presented it and as you claim that it is. If you want to try to slam me for your own feelings of inadequacy, knock yourself out. When the dust settles, you will still be a lowly bank boy with a lousy payout and I will be a solid prospector with a 90% payout. You can't change those facts.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

LOL, an idiot or a liar?  Gosh Bobby, you're such a tough guy.
Bobby, it is so funny to watch you get your little feathers ruffled, then puff out your chest and declare yourself a "solid prospector with a 90% payout."
Just because you misunderstood plain English, doesn't mean it isn't so.  It is so funny to watch you squirm.

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:
LOL, an idiot or a liar?  Gosh Bobby, you're such a tough guy.
Bobby, it is so funny to watch you get your little feathers ruffled, then puff out your chest and declare yourself a "solid prospector with a 90% payout."
Just because you misunderstood plain English, doesn't mean it isn't so.  It is so funny to watch you squirm.

Go look at your own post. You got tripped up in your own words, Mr. 20% Payout.

Vin Diesel's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-18

the best brokers are bank brokers. we can focus our time on advising clients instead of cold calling all day.  and the paychecks are nice too!

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

Vin Diesel wrote:
the best brokers are bank brokers. we can focus our time on advising clients instead of cold calling all day.  and the paychecks are nice too!

How nice for you, Vin Weasel.

bankrep1's picture
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Joined: 2004-12-02

Vin Diesel wrote: the best brokers are bank brokers. we can focus our time on advising clients instead of cold calling all day.  and the paychecks are nice too!

Vin I do not believe this is true. I believe the bank is the best place to start, as far as whose the best we are spread over different venues, but once you're firmly established I would explore all options..

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

bankrep1 wrote: Vin Diesel wrote:
the best brokers are bank brokers. we can focus our time on advising clients instead of cold calling all day.  and the paychecks are nice too!
Vin I do not believe this is true. I believe the bank is the best place to start, as far as whose the best we are spread over different venues, but once you're firmly established I would explore all options..

Vin Weasel has to tell himself this to keep from crying.

Oldproducer's picture
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Joined: 2007-05-14

Vin Diesel wrote: the best brokers are bank brokers. we can focus our time on advising clients instead of cold calling all day.  and the paychecks are nice too!

If this isn't the sarcasm that it should be, then I presume you have never worked anywhere else but a bank. Back in my naivity, I thought the first place that I started at was the "best," as well. As you mature, I hope you can see beyond your bank president's Jockey shorts/Victoria's Secret thong/whatever.

BullBroker's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-26

The problem with this argument is that "best" is a relative term.  Are bank brokers the "best" at having clients handed to them, without having to prospect?  Yes.  Do bank brokers have the "best" payout?  No.  Do they have access to a wide variety of quality products?  Usually not.  Everyone's situation is different there really is no "best broker situation"  (while indy's will argue this) all have positives and negatives. 

farotech's picture
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Joined: 2007-01-05

Slam people into VAs and get max payout. That's the only way bank brokers can pay their bills.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

LOL.  With a payout the same as a wire, your post makes about zero sense. 

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:LOL.  With a payout the same as a wire, your post makes about zero sense. 
 
The payout you detailed in another post didn't look anything like a wirehouse payout to me.

troll's picture
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BTW, that doesn't mean I agree with farotech's comment.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

My payout grid averages around 35% to 37.5%.  That isn't much different than wirehouses.  You all can argue with me if you want, but I have good friends at ML, SB, and UBS.  We talk frequently and they all hover around 35-40%.
The morons on here you have never stepped foot inside a wirehouse (Mike I'm not referring to you) have no idea what the payout structures are, and just repeat what other morons say.  The blind leading the blind.

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

BankFC wrote:
My payout grid averages around 35% to 37.5%.  That isn't much different than wirehouses.  You all can argue with me if you want, but I have good friends at ML, SB, and UBS.  We talk frequently and they all hover around 35-40%.
The morons on here you have never stepped foot inside a wirehouse (Mike I'm not referring to you) have no idea what the payout structures are, and just repeat what other morons say.  The blind leading the blind.

do we HAVE to go to a wirehouse branch to understand the comp structure? can't we just go to onwallstreet.com and read it ourselves? is it ok if we ask our friends that work at them or are you the only one who has friends there? did your mom have any kids that thrived?

Edward Pwns's picture
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Joined: 2007-05-23

Bobby, you should write a book titled "How to be an excellent prospector and type messages on the internet all day at the same time".  Nobody is buying your BS.

farotech's picture
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Joined: 2007-01-05

That's all you bank wusses do all day. Slap people with IRAs into VAs and generate max commission. I hate you people.

bankrep1's picture
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Joined: 2004-12-02

farotech get back on the phone. With a name like that I bet your doing a much better job for your clients...

scrim67's picture
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Joined: 2005-04-28

farotech wrote:
That's all you bank wusses do all day. Slap people with IRAs into VAs and generate max commission. I hate you people.
And the reason this couldn't happen at a wirehouse is......?
Unfortunately there are a few bad apples in every orchard
scrim

Ashland's picture
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Joined: 2007-03-06

PUHLEEEZE!

My product mix as a bank rep is 60% funds/managed money. 25% VA's, 5% UIT's, 8% Insurance and under 5% in Fixed Income & FA's.

I will at the end of the year achieve a 31% payout - 36% on managed money. I will do over $300K my first year out. In addition, I'm putting about $500K into managed money monthly at an average of .9-1% / yr to the grid.

Let's say you do $125K in your first year at a wirehouse, and get paid 45%(yeah, right!).

.31 * 300 = $93K

.45 * 125 = $56K

I know why you hate bank brokers, but it's not because we slam people into VA's. It's that we know where the money is, we see more people, we do it at our desks, and we get to have a life.

rankstocks's picture
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Joined: 2005-02-10

Ashland,
    Considering it is your first year, I will fill you in on a few things.  First, congratulations on gathering assets so quickly.  However, because you choose to work at a bank, you will lose significant assets to competitors because of loyalty issues.  Banks are great at CD and savings, but why would anyone go to a place that can't even manage your checking account correctly?
    I have posted threads about bank, credit union, and discount brokers before and don't care to reiterate, but I know too many that have failed at a real firm to take a 50k/year gig at the local chop bank.

no idea's picture
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Joined: 2005-11-15

Ashland I think the real question here is; do bank brokers have to pay for their own toilet paper?
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troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

no idea wrote:Ashland I think the real question here is; do bank brokers have to pay for their own toilet paper?

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You can't pay for something that you can't afford.

BullBroker's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-26

Ashland-most wires have a declining grid, meaning the longer you have been there the lower payout you recieve.  I think the guys that have been in our office over 20 year are only getting a 30%-35% payout.  As someone who has not been there 20 years it is very easy to get a 45%+ payout.  Our managed money platforms can get as high as 60% payouts and up to 3% annually to the client, but rarely does an FA stick a client like that.  But, you do get money handed to you at a bank that has got to make up for low payouts a little bit.   

whitewlfz's picture
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Joined: 2006-12-23

I feel compelled to hop in here again .. with the whole BANK BROKERS suck rant that I read on here too too often..
Here are reallities about bank programs (mind you not all bank gigs are quite the same but!)
1.. we do get leads from the bank .. it is just that the frequency and quality do vary
2.. our payouts on average are between 30 % - 39 % with a bonus structure .. like in the case of my bank ..the bonus runs between 1-6%
3.. we also usually get a place to call an office ..and here again depending on the bank can vary between a cube in a branch ..to a individual office in a building ..
4.. we do have varying (sp?) availability on product offerings .. myself I have  a wide access to investment products and we do participate in some new offerings...
5.. we also have a wide array of people in our oragnization as does any .. so in turn not all advisors are equal ANYWHERE!
now as for it being a graveyard for failed producers .. I was with a small planning firm so I knew what is was to grind out and prospect  .. I worked the 60 70 hour weeks..and I was at about 300k gross per year after 3 years ..which in the end was not doing bad.. I think by anyones standard..
So lets address why indies get so self rightous..
1.. they work like crazy to get prospects in the begining and if they do it right will get referrals in the end..
2.. they have more independence with how they craft their careers and AUM growth/product mix
3.. they get the all mighty GRID payout of 99% or something of the like...
BUT! I can tell you in the end there is maybe about a 10-15% difference between what they would make vs what a good bank rep would make .. after you add up all the additional things that come with the position at a good bank.. AND I know you indies will argue that there is a markup on what I am told it costs to provides such and such .. but I don't think it is as great as you would hope it is..
Reality there are many ways to skin a cat.. just pick the channel that suits you best.. period.. and for that then can we get off the bank bashing now.. it is tired and old ..and makes you all look like you have nothing too do..

bankrep1's picture
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Joined: 2004-12-02

White,

Some people do not understand the seperation between work and play. I read somewhere on these boards that if you an advisor you have to live it 24/7 abd revolve your life around your career. I don't. I work to live. The bank is the best place to do that.

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

bankrep1 wrote:White, Some people do not understand the seperation between work and play. I read somewhere on these boards that if you an advisor you have to live it 24/7 abd revolve your life around your career. I don't. I work to live. The bank is the best place to do that.
Your mom should consider a retroactive abortion.

bankrep1's picture
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Joined: 2004-12-02

Yeah, yeah, keep talking, someday you might say something intelligent.

the word's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-16

HA Ha ha.  I am laughing at all you non bank brokers.  Lets be real here, you don't like prospecting and cold calling.  I don't like it.  It sucks.  Therefore, i choose to take a job that requires very little of either.  Money either walks in or is sent to my office.   That is the only difference bertween you and I.  Yep, I can offer any product under the SUN. 
On top of that I will make over six figures this year and don't work on Friday.  Oh yeah, I'm 27.  If you think your job is better, congratulations.  This works for me.
 

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

the word wrote:
HA Ha ha.  I am laughing at all you non bank brokers.  Lets be real here, you don't like prospecting and cold calling.  I don't like it.  It sucks.  Therefore, i choose to take a job that requires very little of either.  Money either walks in or is sent to my office.   That is the only difference bertween you and I.  Yep, I can offer any product under the SUN. 
On top of that I will make over six figures this year and don't work on Friday.  Oh yeah, I'm 27.  If you think your job is better, congratulations.  This works for me.
 

You're gonna make 7 figures this year?
By the way...I love prospecting. I love closing large deals. Of course, I'm more of an entrepreneur, as opposed to an employee, like you. I like to make things happen, not have things happen TO me. I could parachute from an airplane anywhere in the world and as long as I have a telephone and a list of phone numbers, I'll be fine. You'll be fine as long as someone hires you to build their business and hands you work to do.

the word's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-16

I'll be fine b/c i have other sources of income.  I am a corporation with many divisions.  Financial advising being one of them. 
That is also why i work in a bank.  The position gives me a good income with time left to pursue other endeavors.  Will i make seven figures in the bank.  No.  Will my other pursuits and advising pay seven, not yet, but it will.
By the way my bank program is more like an indy program.  I choose all the products that we will use for the program.  Bank management doesn't have a clue as to what I do.  As long as they see a check, all is well.  So i have to differ on the employee statement.
Large deals, i have a 412i in the pipeline that will GDC about $200,000.  Banker sent them to my office.

BankFC's picture
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Joined: 2005-05-27

Bobby, it's okay...it's really understandable.  It's okay to feel the way you do.
When I graduated college, myself and two friends all went into the industry.  The difference?  One was completely taking over his retiring father's $52MM (that means million Bobby) book, and the other was going to junior broker for his Dad, who only had about $150MM in his book.
What did I have?  Squat.  But I worked my a$$ off and stayed in despite the struggle, and envy of my friends' guaranteed success.  I felt just like you Bobby, like I was on some higher moral ground because I was creating something from nothing, rather than having it handed to me. 
But you know what???  It isn't higher ground...it's just what you have to tell yourself to keep from throwing yourself out the 21st floor after weeks at a time of fruitless cold calling.  Why wouldn't you take every advantage available?  When the bank came knocking, I jumped.  Why?  Because it was like I finally got to inherit a book...not a book of clients mind you, but a huge book of OPPORTUNITIES.  Needless to say, these few years later I am on much more equal footing with my two friends than I was grinding it out at the wirehouse.
So as you can see, I understand your envy...so I can excuse your silly little comments.
 

Vin Diesel's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-18

i just laugh at the wirehouse & indy guys making fun of bank brokers. keep making fun of us, and we will keep making the $$$

the word's picture
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Joined: 2007-04-16

.....making the money, with considerably less work.  How can someone be criticized for making there job easier?

NYBankRep's picture
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Joined: 2007-03-08

Why are any of you giving Hull the time of day?
Lets look at some facts:
He has posted 729 times since March 13. That is almost 9 times a day (including weekends) If you exclude weekends he posts almost 13 times a day.
Do you really think he is the big closer he likes to talk about?
Think about it. If you posted on here 10 times a day, how much time would you have to be Mr. Prospector? He has no credibilty and I am tired of him taking good threads and degrading them to this drivel.
It would be best to just not answer him. It is obvious he is someone that doesn't have a job, or has one that he does not like and is not good at. Just leave him alone, he will go away.
 

troll's picture
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Joined: 2004-11-29

NYBankRep wrote:
Why are any of you giving Hull the time of day?
Lets look at some facts:
He has posted 729 times since March 13. That is almost 9 times a day (including weekends) If you exclude weekends he posts almost 13 times a day.
Do you really think he is the big closer he likes to talk about?
Think about it. If you posted on here 10 times a day, how much time would you have to be Mr. Prospector? He has no credibilty and I am tired of him taking good threads and degrading them to this drivel.
It would be best to just not answer him. It is obvious he is someone that doesn't have a job, or has one that he does not like and is not good at. Just leave him alone, he will go away.
 

Another one takes the bait...

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